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Halfway Home

May 17, 2008 11:07 PM

Twins Ballpark Construction Progress 2007 to 2008

Two years ago there was tension at the Capitol.

Two years from now there will be baseball in a former rail yard.

That puts us at just about exactly the halfway point in this little project -- that is if you don't count the half-decade or so spent on design, the decade spent wooing politicians, the two-and-a-half decades in Domeball purgatory, or the nearly five decades waiting for a decent home for the hometown nine.

Come to think of it, we're less than two years away from the end of a project which actually began in the early 1950s when powerful local businessmen made a back room decision to make Minneapolis a major league town.

Some History

For the uninitiated, Met Stadium was built for two reasons: 1) as a replacement home for the Minneapolis Millers whose decrepit (but beloved) Nicollet Park was falling down; and 2) as a lure for the New York Giants (of which the Millers were the Triple-A affiliate) who had expressed interest in relocating.

The Met was built on the cheap (and would be maintained the same way throughout its life) with the understanding that it could and would be upgraded to a major league park if and when a franchise agreed to move here.

When the Giants passed, but Calvin Griffith bit, the place was expanded -- again on the cheap. Once baseball got established here, they reasoned, they'd build a proper home.

Twins Ballpark Construction Comparison 2007-2008 #2

Despite some phenomenal early baseball success, it was the other major tenant of the Met who would chart the course for future stadiums in the Twin Cities. The Vikings wanted out of the Met almost from the start, and despite springing for the gigantic (and way out of proportion for baseball) left field pavilion, they really wanted something else built just for them.

Thus, the Twins' first home in Minneapolis was a shared facility from the start -- in which they soon found themselves as the minority tenant (despite playing quite a few more games there).

The road to the Metrodome was then paved with poor maintenance and some really lousy teams.

Don't get me wrong, I loved the Met (my tribute page is very popular), but everyone knows that it was mostly made of political squabbles, broken promises, temporary bleachers, and a lot of chain-link fencing. When all is said and done, it was not a worthy home for the Twins.

The less said about the Metrodome the better.

Even Earlier Years

Before arriving in Minnesota, the franchise's history of ballparks is also homely at best. Griffith Stadium was another patchwork quilt which evolved over decades into a distinctive but hardly inspired home for the team. It's two most notable features tell much of the story:

1. The wall in center field had a crazy gigantic inward notch, the result of homeowners on the other side refusing to sell.

Griffith Stadium

Griffith Stadium (notch visible in lower photo at far left)

2. The grandstand had multiple roof heights because designers of later additions couldn't be bothered to match what was already there (stories also float around about the expense associated with cutting the steel to the correct length).

Griffith Stadium's predecessor, which stood on the same spot, was of the wood variety. You can probably guess how it met its demise.

And so it is that in April of 2010, for the first time in franchise history, the Minnesota Twins will have a proper home.

It's about time.

Here We Are

That's why I started this web site two years ago. My goal was just to track the design and construction of the ballpark, mostly for my own enjoyment. I did not expect that there would be much of an audience, and thought mine would probably be just one of a bunch of similar sites.

But I'm happy to report that the popularity of this site is off the charts. It's gotten big enough that I had to arrange for a major (and expensive) upgrade this weekend to handle the volume of traffic. Just Google "new Twins ballpark" and you'll see this site there at number two (right behind the Twins official page)!

Work has even begun on translating all of the material collected here into a book once the ballpark is open! Look for it in time for Christmas, 2010.

This two years has flown by. Thanks to all who regularly stop by. You've kept the ideas flowing and the discussion lively.

Thanks also to everybody at the Twins, the Ballpark Authority, Hennepin County, and my other resources for helping me stay on top of the project.

More Sun

I promised more sunny pictures. Just be aware that some of these were taken through a window in Ford Centre. It looked like the windows had been cleaned recently, but they're all still pretty cloudy due to age... (Can anybody help me get on the roof of this or the Minikahda building?)

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Here's the field of posts which will support the third base side of the grandstand. Some walls have started to appear about where the Northstar riders will enter the park.


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A closer look at the bridge and walls. You can see where the tracks will be laid.


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At the other end of the bridge, the configuration of the tracks has become clear.


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This looks up Fifth Street (LRT train visible in the distance). This bridge is also being partially rebuilt (see next photo).


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Looking back toward the ballpark from Third Avenue and Fifth Street. Again, the track configuration is now clearly visible.


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This is the start of construction on the Northstar platform which will feed under the bridge and to a lobby with escalators and elevators just inside the ballpark's public concourse. Compared to the ballpark construction, this looks kind of puny. But the work just to get the trains to come has been positively Herculean. Future generations will look back at this with awe.


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Looking back toward the park from just beyond the north end of the Northstar platform.


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Looking the other direction, again from Ford Centre, you can see what's going on over the tracks. This will be a public promenade.


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Nearby, workers are finishing a support column. The guy at the bottom is using some sort of personal dirt mover (inset). Very cool.


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Working on the main concourse right about directly behind the plate.


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The plate marker is just to the left.


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The plaza as viewed from across the park. The right field overhang section will be built just in from where the plaza supports are.


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Finally, Some News

I confirmed that there will definitely be bench seating of some sort on both sides of the outfield. What this will look like and how much there will be is still to come.

Peace.

Comments


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Rick, I was thinking the same thing. This really is the first REAL home that this 1901 est franchise has ever had. Griffith Stadium was an erector set much like the Met. It's about time is right!

Posted on May 18, 2008 at 09:32 AM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 1

Awesome pics, Rick! Thanks again!

Posted on May 18, 2008 at 11:52 AM by Jeff Highlight this comment 2

completely off topic, but i recently read somewhere that american league charter member chicago white sox are actually a former st. paul nine that used to play in an old league called the "western league" for a time. the st. paul club moved to the south side of chicago in 1901 where they then became the white sox we know today.

pretty interesting. was not aware of that piece of history. no wonder the twins & white sox hate each other so much!

:-)

Posted on May 18, 2008 at 12:25 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 3

It's all true, Betaband. The franchise now known as the "Chicago White Sox" was originally known as the "St. Paul Saints".

What's more, their original ballpark, also called "Comiskey Park", was located at Aurora and Dale, just north of I-94 in St. Paul. (Click my name.)

Posted on May 18, 2008 at 1:28 PM by Rick 4

That's right Betaband. They started out as the Sioux City Cornhuskers. They became the St. Paul Saints in 1884 when Charles Comiskey moved them to St. Paul. They played from 1884 - 1900 in St. Paul. The western league became the American League in 1901 when Comiskey moved the Saints to Chicago's south side to become White Stockings.

The team moved in to South Side Park just as the Cubs left the south side for a brief return to the west side. The Cubs eventually landed on the north side in 1916.

Posted on May 18, 2008 at 1:44 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 5

Thanks for filling in the rest of the backstory, kevin.

It leads (sort of) to an article I discovered about another ballpark in Chicago. Before they were on the north side, the Cubs were on both the south side AND the west side.

There's a movement on to place a marker at the site of their former ballpark -- which was also the site of their last World Series win (exactly 100 years ago).

That forgotten ballpark is also where the phrase "out in left field" was coined -- though you may be surprised at what it referred to. (Click my name, and be sure to look at the cool diagram superimposed on a satellite photo.)

Posted on May 18, 2008 at 1:55 PM by Rick 6

Thanks for all the great work you do, Rick. I'm looking forward to that book.

We've got a few more updated panoramic shots up over at Minnescraper (link through handle)

Posted on May 18, 2008 at 3:29 PM by Midwest Product Highlight this comment 7

Also off topic, there's been a great discussion on this forum in the past about transit and the fear of Pawlenty cutting funding. Well, I just received this in my email:

Hurrah! The news just broke at the Capitol: House and Senate leadership and the Governor have agreed upon a budget resolution and a new bonding bill! Good news for supporters of a region-wide transit system: $70 million in state funding for the Central Corridor light rail transit line in the bonding bill, which keeps us on track for receiving nearly $500 million in federal funding and opening the line in 2014.

Posted on May 18, 2008 at 3:39 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 8

kevin in az - great news about central corridor. it would have been a huge, huge mistake to not get that through this year. it is such an important piece of the metrowide transit puzzle starting to come together piece-by-piece.

so rick who gets to write the foreword in your book?!

Posted on May 18, 2008 at 3:57 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 9

Good to hear about the bench seating in the outfield. As always, great pics.

Posted on May 18, 2008 at 7:20 PM by Lafferty Highlight this comment 10

Bench seating is great news!!!! bleacher bums 2010!!

Posted on May 18, 2008 at 10:48 PM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 11

yep, good on the twins to include some outfield bench seating.

Posted on May 19, 2008 at 08:23 AM by Tim Highlight this comment 12

Just continuing the side-bar thread regarding the Saint Paul Saints. Follow the link to the ownership group information for the Saints and you will note that a Veeck is still involved with the Saints. The same ownership groups owns the Fort Myers Miracle the Twins High Class A affiliate.

Posted on May 19, 2008 at 09:26 AM by Mo Highlight this comment 13

Mo - not for long (on the Ft. Meyers thing)... Scroll down to the second story on my link, and you'll see that Veeck is selling his interests in organized ball (including the Miracle).

Moose

Posted on May 19, 2008 at 10:15 AM by Moose97 Highlight this comment 14

Sorry for the back-to-back posts here, but the first signs of the upper-deck concourse are starting to appear on the web-cam right now in the RF corner...

Moose

Posted on May 19, 2008 at 10:59 AM by Moose97 Highlight this comment 15

Rick, thanks for the great pictures, as usual! I stop by here every day.

Posted on May 19, 2008 at 11:41 AM by Dave T Highlight this comment 16

I stumbled upon this site last week. I am so disappointed I did not find it sooner. I was stuck looking at the Twins Webcam for the last 6 months/daily. These pics taken over the weekend are awesome. Thank you! I am so anxious to hear who will get the naming rights for the stadium. What else has anyone heard on this besides the Fox9 report? Here are a few of the suggestions I've heard and made up:
Target Park
Kemps Field
Best Buy Stadium
Northwest Airlines Stadium
Cambria Field
Lawson Software Stadium
Waste Management Dump (Just Kidding)
West Publishing Field
Wells Fargo Field (Conflict on Interest with Pollads??)
Dodge/ Jeep/ Chrysler Stadium
LandOLakes Field (previously mentioned)
Carlson Companies Stadium
Glen Taylor Gift Cards Park

Rick, Do you know when the official announcement of the naming rights will be made? I think I heard Summer, 2008. Go Twins! -Locker

Posted on May 19, 2008 at 12:55 PM by Locker Highlight this comment 17

Rick, the sixth photo you took gave me an idea. It looks like there's an older BNSF track there that is being covered up by construction. It would be kind of neat to pay tribute to the site's history as a railyard somehow. Perhaps rails could be embedded into the plaza and/or the Northstar portion of the transit station _a_la_ what was done with the east entrance to the Mill City Museum. There is lots of old streetcar rail being torn up on Lake Street right now.

But it's probably too late to incorporate into plans now. Too bad.

I was also driving over by St. Paul Union Depot on Sunday and took Jackson down to Shepard Road. There are old rails peaking through there that used to run to the Union Depot concourse. It would be great to expose some of this stuff and create a sense of history both at the ballpark and at Union Depot when it is renovated.

Posted on May 19, 2008 at 1:12 PM by David Highlight this comment 18

David,

I'm pretty sure that old track that's currently got a fence running down the center will eventually be replaced with a new track in the same location that will be one of the platform tracks for the Northstar downtown station.

Posted on May 19, 2008 at 1:31 PM by Alex B. Highlight this comment 19

Alex B.

Yeah, I wasn't suggesting that very track be used. It just sparked the idea.

Posted on May 19, 2008 at 4:42 PM by David Highlight this comment 20

Click my name for an article in the MinnPost regarding decisions being made about food service at the new park. Sounds like they have some good ideas.

Posted on May 19, 2008 at 5:58 PM by Don T Highlight this comment 21

y'know, it's pretty amazing that for over a year now there hasn't been a whiff of anything going wrong w/ the park. knocking on wood as i write...

Posted on May 19, 2008 at 7:01 PM by yeahklye Highlight this comment 22

don't worry yeahkyle, it's still early spring. One of those late May/early June severe storms may blow over a crane or two.

j/k I hope.

Posted on May 19, 2008 at 7:43 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 23

Don T

I just read that article. If they serve sausages from Kramarczuk's at the new ballpark, I may have to move back up there for the entire summer and buy season tickets just to eat those...GREAT IDEA!

Posted on May 19, 2008 at 7:51 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 24

Locker, The naming rights are coming late 2008, probably not this summer...Read the previous posts at the bottom of the page there are links to Land o' Lakes Field?!?, Fox9 Report on ballpark names, Ballpark name domain wrap-up, and Twins to Speculators: Hold Your Domains!

Posted on May 20, 2008 at 10:28 AM by Tom Highlight this comment 25

kevin: hell yeah. the Twins'd be nuts not to have Kramarczuk's sausages at the new park. I don't see why they're not at the Dome now. If they had Kramarczuk's polish sausage and Matt's Jucy Lucys, the new park would be legendary! I can't wait.

Posted on May 20, 2008 at 1:17 PM by Don T Highlight this comment 26

Toss in some fried cheese curds and a decent bbq operation (non chain) and it would be swell

Posted on May 20, 2008 at 2:59 PM by MAZARATIRICK Highlight this comment 27

Yeah, we better have some cheese curds there, and a decent ranch sauce to dip them in.
Killebrew should start a resturaunt along the lines of Matty B's, Joe Sensers, etc, and that should be the resturaunt in the new stadium.

Posted on May 20, 2008 at 3:25 PM by Robert Highlight this comment 28

A non-chain BBQ option would be nice, but at this point we should probably resign ourselves to Famous Dave's (or maybe Rudolph's). Eh, could be worse. I think we ought to start a letter-writing campaign to Rick Abramson and Delaware North re: getting Kramarczuk's and Matt's Bar involved.

Posted on May 20, 2008 at 3:43 PM by Midwest Product Highlight this comment 29

yea, the fam daves @ the dome kinda sucks... outside on the plaza is better options than just pulled park sammich.. market or rudis would be cool... do you think matt;s bar outside of the twincities would enough name recongnition to get in the new ball park?

Posted on May 20, 2008 at 3:48 PM by MAZARATIRICK Highlight this comment 30

How 'bout bringing up Roscoe's BBQ from Rochester? Them's good eatin".

Posted on May 20, 2008 at 5:35 PM by Dodgeboy Highlight this comment 31

My food vendor wishlist:

Kramarczuk's
Matt's Bar, Jucy Lucy (none of that 5-8 misspelled nonsense)
Mai Village
Pineda Tacos and Burritos
State Fair fried pickle chips (with or without cream cheese)

Posted on May 20, 2008 at 6:04 PM by David Highlight this comment 32

David,

I miss Mai Village so much. When I lived up there and worked near the capitol I would hit those Univ Ave Asian restaurants weekly. Have you ever tried Hoa Bien, Treiu Chau? Those are great vietnamese joints. And the new Chinese place that opened up in the old Mai Village bldg is AWESOME! I saw Andrew Zimmern eating there one day and he said it's the best chinese he's tasted in MN.

Posted on May 20, 2008 at 6:34 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 33

Good call with the fried pickle chips. How about this state fair staple: the pronto pup! I can't believe they don't have these at the Metrodome already. It's a unique item that would give our concessions a local flair, but it's not too gimicky. It's a good ballpark food item. What could be better at a game than a corn dog on a stick with the ketchup and mustard slathered on with a paintbrush.

On a related topic, I hope this food company does some good things with the local beer selection. I'd love to see Grain Belt right next to every Budweiser and Miller Lite tap. It would also be great to have a few beer stands that just have local brews on tap like Summit, Leine's, Schell's, and even Surly.

One more thought: since this vendor is looking towards small, local restraunts for food ideas, how about drinks, too? Wouldn't it be great to see a Psycho Suzi's tiki bar stand that sold cocktails. Or how about a Gastof's stand that would sell beer in the boot(not glass, of course; and probaly smaller)? These may be a bit far fetched, but you never know.

Posted on May 20, 2008 at 9:29 PM by Chris Highlight this comment 34

I just want Mountain Dew!!!

Why is it that most stadiums can have BOTH Bud and MIller products, plus specialties, while its ALWAYS Coke or Pepsi? They let you, the consumer, choose beer, but not soda!?!

Posted on May 20, 2008 at 9:46 PM by Dodgeboy Highlight this comment 35

I meant to say the other day...

I came across that Met Stadium page a long time ago - loved all the pics and discussion, especially for someone who never got to see it live. Now I find out that its another work of yours Rick!?! I'm even more impressed!

Posted on May 20, 2008 at 11:56 PM by Excited Highlight this comment 36

is that "patchwork glory" site yours too Rick? I was looking at it and saw my comment on the page from 2002 I remember when i first came across it how excited i was... the rememebrign the met page used to be called patchwork glory correct?

also gastofs boot that would be fun and crazy!!!! just no snorting the snuff!!! ha

Posted on May 21, 2008 at 07:56 AM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 37

Thanks Tom,
I checked that out. Looks like LandOLakes Field or LandOLakes Park. Very Cool!

Posted on May 21, 2008 at 12:18 PM by Locker Highlight this comment 38

I have trouble getting excited about overpriced and underqualitied stadium food. Hot dogs, beer, and frosty malts are the only staples required. When I lived in Cincinnati, Marge Schott (rest her racist soul) vowed that they would always have $1 hot dogs as long as she ran the place. And they did. Granted, they got skinnier every year, but a principal is a principal and rare to find.

Posted on May 21, 2008 at 1:52 PM by Badjuggler Highlight this comment 39

I agree dodgeboy, bring Roscoe's BBQ up from Rochester!

I hope and I assume that Pepsi will be the official soft drink in the new ballpark. It's so stupid that Pepsi is an official sponsor of the Twins, but yet they can't sell Pepsi products at their games due to the Coca-Cola contract that is signed with the MSFC. I need Mountain Dew too!

The Twins are getting robbed in their deal with the MSFC and the Metrodome and 2010 can't come soon enough!

Posted on May 21, 2008 at 3:32 PM by Luke H. Highlight this comment 40

Badjuggs this is so true... the dome has made us all into ballpark food haters, even thou they have other things that might sound interesting (fam daves) its not good food compared to say what you would get outside the dome.. some ballparks have good food but yes it is all over priced.. the shyboygen in kansas city rocks.. its 7 bucks but its twice the size of a normal brat,, and has tones of stuff on it , me and my girlfriend share them so it eats 2.. not at the dome.. they dont even try to mask it and make it look like a deal.. 5.25 for a hot dog and palin chips in a bag...im looking forward to the new food but by then alot of us wont be able to afford to eat at the ball park much anymore which in turn might create deals i would hope like one buck hot dogs evey day not just once a week.

Posted on May 21, 2008 at 3:47 PM by MAZARATIRICK Highlight this comment 41

Do the Twins get to pick which beverage companies they have a contract with in the new stadium or does the company that they picked to do the food and beverage service have contracts with certain beverage companies already. That might determine what choices one might have in the new stadium maybe. But some local stuff might not be a bad thing as other people metioned here already.

Posted on May 21, 2008 at 10:43 PM by Leroy Highlight this comment 42

The thing with ballpark food is that (like everything else you can buy in the stadium) it is going to be overpriced. To be honest however, Boog's BBQ at Camden Yards and Gates BBQ in KC were both worth every penny. I don't remember how much it was, but I guarantee that the smell of ribs drifting across a beautiful green field inside a terrific ballpark on a spectacular summer day is priceless. Both KC and Baltimore have some of the most friendly fans in baseball, which helps too. Thanks for the great site!

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 08:46 AM by James Highlight this comment 43

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think the Twins have control of what they want as far as food and beverages and other concessions in the new stadium. They are paying Delaware Sportservice to operate and control the ballpark food and beverage concessions. I am sure the Twins will have some specifics (as far as certain brands/products) built into the contract that Delaware Sportservice would have to comply with. Again, I could be wrong, but I am pretty sure the Twins and Delaware Sportservice will both have a say in what will be sold in the new ballpark as far as food/beverage choices.

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 08:55 AM by Luke H. Highlight this comment 44

I dont know about the camden yards... but the Gates at Kaufman is great, the only thing is they dont sell ribs.. just sammiches... still awsome and spendy.. 11 bucks for a pulled pork sammich and a side of hot baked beans it really helped whenwe were there in april with the game time temp 2 35 degrees... like the fam daves at the dome inside they dont sell anything except sammiches ( as far as meat.. o ribs) ...the gates is far better and much more worht the monry than the famous daves here.

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 10:28 AM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 45

The Twins added some construction pics on 5/15, including a close-up of the limestone. Click link, then click sights and sounds. They also added some audio...

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 12:05 PM by Lafferty Highlight this comment 46

mazaratirick - what is a "sammiches"? please do tell. i have had a sandwich before, but never a "sammiches".

just kidding buddy!

:-)

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 12:35 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 47

Lafferty - Where are these pics you are referring to? I tried to find them on the twinsbaseball.com site, but no luck.

Can you post a link to them?

Thanks

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 12:52 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 48

Nevermind Lafferty. I see you have already done that.

Please excuse both my stupidity and lack of observation!!

Peace....

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 12:54 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 49

No worries Betaband. I also posted the limestone pic at the Baseball Fever 'Twins Stadium' thread.

Thankfully the Twins aren't using precast stone/concrete for the facade.

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 1:17 PM by Lafferty Highlight this comment 50

Ahhh, I see Beta band you are one of those typs huh... your joke is so funny...oh boy i better keep taking it down a fe w more notches ... to stick with the cool posters.

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 3:22 PM by MAZARATIRICK Highlight this comment 51

mazaratirick - nope, not one of "those" posters. what ever that means. i do know that I have been posting here much longer than you though and seem to get along fine with most. just wanted to see how you would respond to some friendly "ball busting" considering you came out of nowhere in the last couple weeks and seem to think you are some kind of representative for the "every man" or “blue collar man” on this board, which is kind of a joke in and of itself since no one here is some “elitist snob” like you like to say.

your defensive, somewhat "whiny" response to what i jokingly said about your last post is exactly what i expected from you based on your record to date with others on this board.

not trying to hate on you mazaratirick, but you really need to get over yourself and quit the whole “woe is me” routine when someone challenges you or jokes around with you about anything you say.

learn how to take a little friendly razzing buddy. it will go a long way.

later.....

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 5:04 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 52

Paxil would go a long way too...

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 6:25 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 53

Look at me, world! Pay attention to me! I can write three paragraphs filled with mindless drivel! Gold star for me! Hoo-ray!

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 7:03 PM by betaband Highlight this comment 54

Betaband,

It's been my experience that if you have trolls on a forum that type a lot but contribute nothing in their comments, ignore them. They will go away. This is why I haven't acknowledged a word he's said since his tailgating hissy fit. I think in 6 or 7 posts he reiterates how wonderful Gates BBQ is at Kauffman. Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz. Gates isn't even close to being the best BBQ in KC. Arthur Bryant's and Fiorella's Jack Stack are far better than Gates.

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 7:46 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 55

beta band and kev are really 2 peas in a pod, this is a web site fellas maybe you 2 need to get over yourself, congrats on being on here longer than me!!!! maybe we can get you two a medal or somthing. its funny how the more you two post in resposne so real simple things i post about ( tailgating,ballpark food) the more you two go on tirades. hey whatever makes you guys happy is fine with me but i do suspect you are unhappy in your non "cyper" lives.

as for i toot the gates horn a lil to often and i swear by it i dont belive that is true, you should go back thru the blog and check these comments there as you both know there is no jack stacks or aurther bryants in the ballpark at kaufman so i was mearly comparing BALLPARK foods, aurther bryants is my favorite and istop by the spot on brooklyn ave everytime im in town so please lay off the web site bulling here im sure you both are well old enough to have learned from being picked on as kids that 2 wrongs do not make a right.

im not sure how long you have been on the website and really dont care either, im sorry that you feel threatend by another person whoenjoys this site and baseball as much as you... you 2 seem to attack others and gang up on people who simple arent in ur " good ol boys" club..if you were to stop your very obvious HATER WAYS and ask me when the first time i posted o this site is??? well it was way back when there were no pics on this page b4 construction and when Rick asked for ballpark ideas.. so yes you are better than all, your grand wisdom and tales are at the least entertaining. so i will enjoy listing to you to and your twisted ways for years to come..

and i am the one with a hissy fit huh.... sweet!!!!

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 9:12 PM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 56

spellcheck mazarati....TRY it for once....PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 10:18 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 57

Everybody just take a deep breath:

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm, aaaaaaaaaaaaah!

There, that feels better.

It's all ballpark lovers here.

(I've got a bunch of new panoramas that I hope to post later tonight...)

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 10:31 PM by Rick 58

If the twins do have control over things like beverages and the like and I think they do that would be a great thing. Anything would be a slight bit better than whats at the dome. Now that we are on the subject. Are they going to have food booths on the new plaza as they do now at the metrodome twins plaza that would be cool since we spend more there than anywhere else in the ballpark.

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 10:44 PM by Leroy Highlight this comment 59

mazaratirick - if you are going to take the time to impersonate me when posting here please at least get the spelling of my moniker right.

as you will see in all prior posts i always capitalize Betaband. our letter today kids is "B". as in "B"etaband.

ha, ha! no worries though. its all good mazarati! you are just a little over zealous in everything you do and that's cool. to each his own i guess.

turn it down a notch or turn it up a notch for all i care. just make sure it is at least somewhat relevant & coherent is all that i ask.

in the end though we have at least one thing in common. and that is we are both twins fans. and well, i guess that's all that really matters here on rick’s fine site.

and to that i say good night folks. have a wonderful memorial day weekend and stay safe out there!

Posted on May 22, 2008 at 11:12 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 60

Fun stuff, back to baseball sounds good to me!!!

Posted on May 23, 2008 at 07:43 AM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 61

i love watching the cranes move constantly out my office window....

Posted on May 23, 2008 at 09:11 AM by annoying customer Highlight this comment 62

A.C. I'm so jealous...

Posted on May 23, 2008 at 11:18 AM by Locker Highlight this comment 63

yes....MORE baseball and LESS sammiches!

Posted on May 23, 2008 at 11:36 AM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 64

thats right kev more baseball!!!!

Posted on May 23, 2008 at 11:54 AM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 65

my recommend on grub is:

home made cracker jack. you can do it in a kettle corn operation... change the recipe around... make it fresh at the park and sell it in either a Twins cup or a bucket... make a killing. it'd be the signature item... along with the walleye.

the minnpost idea for sweet martha's is brilliant... combined with milk (easy choice if it's LOL Park)... that'd be pretty unique.

i think having fresh roasted sweet corn would be another one that would draw a crowd.

Posted on May 23, 2008 at 1:57 PM by CJ Highlight this comment 66

click my name for a crappy cell phone picture i took today from the top floor of my building

Posted on May 23, 2008 at 5:35 PM by annoying customer Highlight this comment 67

sorry, here's a good link of it

Posted on May 23, 2008 at 5:43 PM by annoying customer Highlight this comment 68

AC,

Looking at your picture, I just have one comment...What on god's green earth where they thinking when designing the Target Center??? What an eyesore of a building that is!

Posted on May 23, 2008 at 6:00 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 69

All it really needs is a new exterior scheme. Ok that's "all" in quotes.

Posted on May 23, 2008 at 6:39 PM by Andrew Highlight this comment 70

After the last week or so, and the two controversial non-home runs at Yankee Stadium (the one off the LF foul pole, and the A-Rod one off the staircase in RF), plus the Twins HR tonight at Comerica (a new ballpark, so don't tell me that it's just a problem at old-out of date parks) off a railing - it got me thinking about how this problem could be avoided at the new Twins park.

Right now, they don't sell the front row in LF at the Metrodome, but that obviously won't fly at the new park. Some of the best ways to avoid HR problems are to place a gap between the fans and the fence (ala LF at Comerica), or to put some kind of planting between the fans and the fence (small flowers, or shrubs).

What are folks thoughts on this? I think the Twins will want to get the fans as close as possible to the action, but avoind the controversay of the last few HR problems from the past week... Either a gap (as small as possible) or plants should do the trick.

Moose

Posted on May 23, 2008 at 11:01 PM by Moose97 Highlight this comment 71

I'm not sure it solves (or is intended to solve) that problem, but all of the renderings clearly show flower boxes along the top of the outfield wall from pole to pole.

Posted on May 23, 2008 at 11:09 PM by Rick 72

looks like instant replay will be coming to mlb soon due to recent events, it would be nice to have the fans as close as possable and just kick out the ones that cant keep there mitts out of the field of play (not saying it would be easy if it were me to lay off a home team dinger).

Posted on May 23, 2008 at 11:18 PM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 73

regarding target center, i never thought of this before but that crappy exterior might really clash w/ the limestone and glass exterior of the twins park.

Posted on May 25, 2008 at 2:06 PM by yeahklye Highlight this comment 74

Personally, I think it would be great if they could somehow incorparate the skyway INTO a revised Target Center facade - eliminating that "endless tunnel."
Also, extend the plaza over 2nd Ave and connect it somehow into the Target Center, instead of just an elevated sidewalk.
That shouldn't cost anything, right? One can dream...

Posted on May 26, 2008 at 10:22 AM by Dodgeboy Highlight this comment 75

So, I'm down at the site on Saturday with my son checking out the progress first hand...and there is Jerry and Phyllis Bell checking it out too. We sgook hands and talked for a little bit. He was pretty excited with the progress to say the least. Watching the train go under the West end is incredible. Pretty awesome!

Posted on May 27, 2008 at 09:24 AM by Locker Highlight this comment 76

DSP has updated his blog today. It includes a well-deserved tribute to the departing Rep. Brad Finstad who as instrumental in getting the ballpark bill through the legislature, including authoring the bill. There are also other interesting tidbits about upcoming bids for interior finishes, graphics/scoreboard and grass planting.

Posted on May 27, 2008 at 12:40 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 77

I don't see anything new

Posted on May 27, 2008 at 12:46 PM by ? Highlight this comment 78

he also mentioned a second webcam...

Posted on May 27, 2008 at 2:04 PM by MOJO Highlight this comment 79

Thank you Kev in Az. I hadn't seen that one yet. THANK YOU REP. FINSTAD ... AWESOME JOB working with the goofballs at the leg. getting this ballpark deal done.

Posted on May 27, 2008 at 2:07 PM by Locker Highlight this comment 80

If you're going to praise Rep. Finstad, who carried the bill but did very little other legwork, you at least need to acknowledge Speaker Margaret Anderson Kelliher, who corralled the DFL and GOP into passing the bill.

It's easy for someone in the minority from a rural district to carry a bill raising metro area taxes. It's MUCH harder to be the Speaker of the House from Minneapolis twisting arms of your metro-area colleagues to raise taxes on their constituents.

Thank you, Margaret, for putting in the REAL work to get it done.

Posted on May 27, 2008 at 3:21 PM by David Highlight this comment 81

Wasn't it Steve Sviggum and Dean Johnson back in 2006? Margaret Anderson Kelliher didn't take over (as Speaker) until the 2007 session.

Not to take anything away from Margaret, but Steve Sviggum and Dean Johnson were some of the big pushers when this passed in 2006.

Posted on May 27, 2008 at 5:31 PM by Luke H. Highlight this comment 82

Luke H., I think you are correct. I'm getting my legislative sessions confused.

I know Margaret was a supporter of the ballpark. But you're right, Johnson and Swiggum did much of the heavy lifting.

Thanks for the correction.

Posted on May 27, 2008 at 6:09 PM by David Highlight this comment 83

Oddly enough - it took Kelliher and Sviggum working together, and a young legislator who had made few enemies to carry the bill to get it done.

the biggest hurdle for the bill was in the Tax committee - where it slid through barely thanks to a number of legislators deft maneuvering.

Posted on May 28, 2008 at 10:53 AM by CJ Highlight this comment 84

Does anyone think that it is going to be a proble that you will have to cross the tracks to get from the stadium to the LRT Station? Currently at the metrodome there is a platform on either side of the tracks, but the new one looks like it is a center platform.

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 10:37 AM by Andrew Highlight this comment 85

You still have to cross the tracks to get to the downtown direction after the game at the Metrodome, which is always a cluster and requires several cops in bright yellow vests to prevent someone from jumping in front of a train. The smart thing to do would be to put a couple simple stairways over the tracks to get to the center without crossing them. Or, since it is the end of the line they could just route people to the end of the tracks, where they could walk onto the center platform.

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 11:08 AM by mplsgreg Highlight this comment 86

Here is another pic of the green seats at Citi Field. (click name)

I really think this shade would look nice at our park. Speaking of which, has anyone seen what the exact shade of green the Twins will be using? The color on the model and the ballpark animation look completely different.

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 2:09 PM by Lafferty Highlight this comment 87

Update anytime soon????

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 2:34 PM by Need update Highlight this comment 88

I JUST got back from spending about an hour down at the site. Lots of new pictures to show.

You may not have noticed, but I've been updating the panorama page quite substantially over the last week. I'm not quite caught up yet, but I'm getting there. (Click the panorama link in the right-hand column at the top of this page -- or my name.)

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 2:44 PM by Rick 89

I've had a chance to get to a few games at Nationals Park - on the subject of seat color, I don't like what they did. They've got navy blue seats - which is fine - but they combined that with a green outfield wall. The overall color palate is all over the board, and doesn't work at all.

Green seats, green padding on the walls. Blue seats, blue padding on the walls.

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 3:41 PM by Alex B. Highlight this comment 90

Last I heard it was going to be a Fenway green at our new ballpark. I think that comes from this site, is this right Rick?

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 4:54 PM by Tom Highlight this comment 91

I thought the seats at Fenway were red. Do they mean "Green Monster Green?" I really can't picture the seats in this shade. (click name)

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 5:05 PM by Lafferty Highlight this comment 92

The seats at Fenway are a variety of colors and styles, depending in large measure on when they were put in (some appear to have been there since 1912!).

Click my name for a somewhat out-of-date profile of Fenway (2002) which contains some photos of the seating. Everybody thinks everything is green there because of the Monster...

Uniform seat colors is a something of a modern phenomenon (starting about 1960, I think, though there are probably some earlier exceptions -- I'll have to check into this in more detail). Back in the days when ballparks were expanded and rebuilt all the time, uniformity in seat color and style was neither a priority nor even possible in many cases.

I have argued in these pages that the Twins would do well to consider a multi-colored formula which features various shades in a narrow green-blue palette. Not only would this recall Met Stadium, but it would make for a richer appearance both up close and on wide TV shots (when the park is not sold out, that is).

As far as I know, however, it's gonna be all green. Which specific green is anybody's guess, but I'd probably put my money on Fenway Green. (My most recent full article on the subject is linked at the bottom of this page: "Being Green" November 5, 2007.)

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 5:56 PM by Rick 93

Click my name....anyone see the disappearing truck? Check the highway.

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 6:36 PM by MOJO Highlight this comment 94

Alas, the panorama software is good, but not perfect...

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 7:29 PM by Rick 95

Ironically I was just in Boston two weeks ago and took a tour of Fenway. The tour guide told us that the seats immediately between the two dugouts are in fact the originals from 1912. They are the oldest in all of baseball, have about 15 layers of paint on them, and look like they have been painted different colors over the years (they are 1/2 red, 1/2 green now - click my name to see the pic). Another fun fact is that the Green Monster wasn't even built until many years after the park opened, and actually was painted BLUE with numerous advertisements covering it. The owner back in the 30's, Mr. Yawkey, wanted to change the color and - like a good husband - had his wife pick it out. Apparently the shade we see was actually named Fen Green.

Also fitting to this website, it was on this trip that I experienced my first ever rainout. We had tickets to Friday night's Brewers-Sox game and waited two hours before they called it off (thought keeping entertained by the the $7.75 beers and celtics/cavs game they were showing on the TV's). Sure enough they scheduled a day/night double header the next day and ended up being one of the most intriguing baseball experiences of my life. To all the outstate worry mongers, make your trip an overnighter and all the rainout worries could be "washed away"...your Twins could potentially be playing two the next day. Get it Twins!

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 7:56 PM by John K Highlight this comment 96

Oops, here's the seat pic

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 7:59 PM by John K Highlight this comment 97

Yes Tom, you are correct. "Fenway Green" is a generic term used for the green seats you will see in the new ballpark. I heard this from a Twins rep at Twinsfest in January. It is the same green you see in Safeco Field, Camden Yards, Miller Park, US Cellular Field, Jacobs Field, Ballpark in Arlington, Minute Maid Park as well as Citi Field.

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 9:32 PM by Luke H. Highlight this comment 98

Let's be sure we're clear on this: All those other ballparks, in an attempt to evoke a classic, used the same green which is found at Fenway Park -- hence the name.

Call it a "generic" term if that makes you feel better (though I do not think that is an accurate characterization), but that doesn't change the fact that all those other parks COPIED SOMEONE ELSE, namely the Boston Red Sox ballpark. Fenway had it first.

I don't dislike the color, but it is has become rather generic. (It's also not like any of the team's official colors.)

My hope is only that the Twins will not be simply the latest copycat...

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 9:44 PM by Rick 99

I hate fenway park, its a joke, the only park where you hit it off the wall and only get a single, they should call it pinball park, also the triangle in center is stupid (Hunter broke his ankle there)

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 10:05 PM by Jon Highlight this comment 100

I am not sure, but I think that "Fenway Green" is a little darker than the green monster. I have never been to Fenway, but the seats at Camden are darker than the green monster. Even though it is still called Fenway green. So I think that the Fenway green will not be like the green monster. Look at the linked picture of the seats at camden yards, and the batting practice tarp being more the color of the green monster. Also look at the citi field seat color which is like at camden. Also if you look at Rick's "Being green" post the seats that are Fenway Green are darker than the monster.

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 11:42 PM by Tom Highlight this comment 101

Good evening gentlemen. Random one for you tonight.

So, do you think they will move over to the new ballpark the #34 gold colored seat where Kirby's "and we'll see you tomorrow night" shot landed in Game 6 of the '91 series? Would they possibly consider adding it to stands somewhere in left-center of the new park? Who wouldn't want to sit in that seat whenever possible?! Especially in the new place. Would be great if they did. Maybe they will place it in the Twins Hall of Fame area instead for preservation purposes instead.

Anyways, just a thought for you great minds to ponder. Let me know what you think.

Peace....

Posted on May 29, 2008 at 11:58 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 102

Just to clarify what I said above, I think that the green seats at Fenway are a differant color than the Green Monster, I thought what I said above sounded a bit confusing. Sorry for the double post...

Posted on May 30, 2008 at 12:06 AM by Tom Highlight this comment 103

Fenway is as much a monument as it is a ballpark. I hate the Yanks, but their stadium is also a historic treasure. Every ballpark has its querks...hopefully with a new park Minnesota won't be known for having speakers hanging from the ceiling that are "in play".

If you've never been to the Fens, I suggest you take a field trip.

Posted on May 30, 2008 at 01:07 AM by Jeff Highlight this comment 104

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Posted on July 23, 2008 at 5:55 PM by zecvsat pendajsr Highlight this comment 105


This page was last modified on January 21, 2010.



"You talk about the magic, the aura, but what really makes a stadium is the fans. Concrete doesn't talk back to you. Chairs don't talk back to you. It's the people who are there, day in, day out, that makes the place magic."

– Bernie Williams

Explore the Site

Here are 50 images chosen randomly from the 3045 found on this site. Click the image to be taken to the original post. A new list is created every 10 minutes.


(Click to enlarge)









Looking north (toward Fifth Street and the LRT station).



The future history of Minnesota ballparks will go here



The Pro Shop



Photo by Jeff Ewer



Eleven flag poles



This little pathway snakes between the LRT tracks and the Environmental Services Building, emptying into the parking area surrounding the HERC. It could be for maintenance, but it looks more like it's for convenience.



You'll be able to park here for a quick stop at the Pro Shop or ticket window.



Hey! An unnumbered gate!









Here's the current overview from the south side of the B ramp (from which the banner at the top of this page was culled).












Also from the B ramp entrance off of Third, a look up at the tiny crack between ballpark and parking ramp



The New as viewed from The Old.






You have to wonder just what happened here. Will it remain forever embedded in cement?



The Metrodome has sure been tarted up.









Wrigley Field viewed while approaching on foot from the northwest









These guys were there, but it wasn't any of you, right?






Glare from the IDS never looked this sweet. (Photo by Jared Wieseler)












Scoreboard in profile against the skyline












Perhaps these very bold, Hitchcockian birds picking at left-over popcorn and peanuts were portents of what was to come.






Path of quick escape.






Now, THIS is just some guy who appears to be hanging out on the LRT tracks talking to himself.



Some fun field facts. (Click to enlarge.)



The littlest Twins fan: Truman






This was on BPM night. Nice neon, but I'm still waiting to see the homer show.



They help create a psychological safe area along the plaza edge, and help you forget that cars are zipping by directly beneath you.



The right field overhang as seen from Seventh Street (with dude)






This is a good overview of the spot where the Northstar (bottom) and LRT (top) will intersect.


Glossary

BPM - Ballpark Magic

BRT - Bus Rapid Transit

DSP - Dave St. Peter

FSE - Full Season Equivalent

FYS - Fake Yankee Stadium (see also: NYS)

HERC - Hennepin Energy Resource Company (aka the Garbage Burner)

HPB - Home Plate Box

HRP - Home Run Porch

LC - Legends Club

LRT - Light Rail Transit

MBA - Minnesota Ballpark Authority (will own Target Field)

MOA - Mall of America

MSFC - Minnesota Sports Facilities Commission (owns the Metrodome)

NYS - New Yankee Stadium

SRO - Standing Room Only

STH - Season Ticket Holder

TCFBS - TCF Bank Stadium

TF - Target Field

Selected Bibliography - Analysis
 


(1993)
 


First Edition (1992)
 


Second Edition (2006)
 


(2008)
 

Selected Bibliography - Surveys
 


(1975)
 


Second Edition (1987)
 


Not a "Third Edition" exactly,
but it replaced the above title
(2000)
 


(2000, large coffee table)
 


Original edition (2000, round)
 


Revised edition (2006, round)
 


(2001, medium coffee table)
 


(2002, small coffee table)
 


(2003, medium coffee table)
 


(2004, very large coffee table)
 


(2006, very large coffee table)
 


Combines the previous two titles
(2007, medium coffee table)
 

Selected Bibliography - Nostalgia
 


(1992)
 


Book and six ballpark miniatures
(2004)
 

Complete Bibliography

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