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Best Ballpark Ever?

It's Time to Take Stock

October 25, 2010 12:51 PM

A few months ago, in something of a surprise, ESPN Magazine ranked Target Field as number one in fan experience across all the major league sporting venues in North America. That's a rather stupefying honor for a facility which had hosted a mere 36 games when the article was published -- and presumably far less when the research was done.

And while it's a badge to be worn proudly, it does highlight the difficulties with such rankings. For one thing, they are highly subjective, despite "scoring" systems which try to provide more measurable, and theoretically objective, criteria (i.e. +2 points for good hot dogs, -3 points for long restroom lines, etc.). Secondly, they are obviously subject to heavy influence by dubious factors such as novelty and giddiness.

Yes, Target Field is novel, and it makes all us ballpark geeks a little bit giddy (especially in Twins Territory), but can it really be declared "coolest of them all" only a few scant weeks after being finished?

Maybe. Read on.

None of us are immune to this type of excitement, of course. It's especially hard to be objective when you've been watching baseball inside a glorified fun jump for three decades.

It means that a lot of the breathless reviews of Target Field that we've seen since April 12 (or before) must be set aside. You really can't tell anything for sure until time has had a chance to scuff the place up a little bit. That's the primary reason I've held off on trying to write any sort of review until now. I wanted to let my natural giddiness settle down a little bit, while also learning a little about what it will be like to live with this park for a long time.

Observation + Instinct

But I do remember at least one moment last spring when I was willing to declare TF the best ballpark in the majors.

At one of the open houses in March, I struck up a conversation with a couple of very skeptical guys that I ran across while they were taking photos of each other in a particularly cramped seat down the first base line. They seemed eager to find flaws, and were all too happy to tell me about another bad seat they had discovered where you couldn't even see home plate (section S, last row).

Open house skeptics

As the conversation continued, I filled in a few blanks for them and, sensing that I might have the answer, one of the guys finally asked if I knew which was the best ballpark in the major leagues. (How and why these skeptics were at this event remains a mystery to this day.)

Without hesitating, and with an air of certainty that surprised even me, I replied, "This one."

"Are you saying that because you know, or are you just a homer?" he asked with an accusatory glance.

Fair question, and comparable in tone to the one I'm inclined to raise about the ESPN Mag ranking. In fact, I don't think anyone actually knows in any real sense which ballpark is the "best" because there really is no such thing. It's like asking, "Who makes the best fish-n-chips in Minneapolis?" It's merely a starting point for discussion, not a quest for the actual answer (though if you have an opinion on that particular subject, I'm definitely interested).

When it comes right down to it, I think there is an argument to be made for TF as the best of the best, at least for the current moment. My argument, which I do not think matches ESPN's, goes like this:

One thing which is obvious to even the casual observer is that Target Field represents the state of the art for baseball stadium design in pretty much every way. Every modern advancement has been employed, a century of experience has been distilled and refined, and certain aspects of the project (notably, the size of the site) forced a level of creativity unseen in any other recent project of this scale (outside of South African soccer venues, that is). The architects and the team set expectations high, then they exceeded them.

They didn't get everything right, of course, but, even if they had, such achievements are usually bested pretty quickly. Target Field may be great, but it's not the best that will ever be (and couldn't touch the classic ballparks of yore, now gone). If it's the best at all, it could only be the best for the moment, to be surpassed someday, likely sooner rather than later.

But in this moment, at the end of its first highly successful season, with accolades pouring in from every corner, and detractors still looking for traction on anything other than nitpicking criticisms, I think it's quite reasonable for someone to claim that Target Field may be the best ballpark in the majors.

Name that ballpark

Surprisingly, not every ballpark which is built can even claim to be the best for its own moment. Four facilities opened between the class of 2004 (Citizens Bank Park and Petco) and Target Field. All of those four (Busch III, Nationals Park, Fake Yankee Stadium, and Citi Field) had serious detractors among fans and ballpark geeks alike. None had even a reasonable claim on being the best ballpark in existence on their respective opening days (outside of their own fan base, of course).

And if you dig a little bit into those ESPN rankings, you'll find an overall "stadium greatness" ranking which suggests that none of the 12 stadiums built between 1999's Safeco and TF were able to lay a claim on the title of "best". (I would argue with that, if only to acknowledge the classic trio of Pac Bell, Comerica and PNC.)

A very early vision for TF's main concourse

So that's how I answered the "homer" question. Sure, I'm a homer, but I'm also a ballpark geek. I hope I can filter out some of my giddiness and do some objective observation and thinking, which is what I'm about to try and do. And even once I do, I'm not going to offer any sort of overall ranking for the park among the current or former major league parks. Rankings aren't generally worth the bits it takes to store them.

Instead, I want to take a broad look at the ballpark, see what works, and get a handle around the (admittedly few) things that don't.

End of an Era?

Before we get to that, I want to take a moment to talk about context and history.

The simplified timeline at left shows that it's rather easy to split the history of baseball stadium design into three broad eras (four if you add a "Pre-Classic Era" for the earliest parks, which were all built hastily out of wood and usually burned down).

Both Met Stadium and the Metrodome appear in the second era, in which conventional wisdom led pretty much everyone to either design or retrofit their facilities for use by multiple sports. The economical reasoning is easy to understand, though it's difficult to figure out why they were still building these in 1990 when the limitations had become widely known as early as 1962. Dollars are that powerful, I guess.

But for this discussion, I want to focus on an alternate designation which often gets applied to this era: the "cookie cutter" generation.

Let's face it, from 1962 to 1991 creativity took a back seat to engineering and economics. No less than 14 stadiums were stamped from the "concrete donut" mold, and telling some of these apart in old photographs can be a fun game. Their donut-ness was bad for the fans, but it was the lack of overall imagination which nearly killed the romance of place which had been so associated with baseball.

Missing: imagination.

If baseball is all about home, then the confines in which the game is played actually matter, and this concept was nearly lost as ballpark design devolved into an exercise in civic manipulation. (An argument can be made that this is what you deserve if you bludgeon governmental entities into financing your facilities.)

Despite not being a donut, the Metrodome is sort of the poster child for the problem. It was and is an efficient building. It actually worked both logistically and financially for the government which built it. It accomplished everything it set out to accomplish, but made a grave error in not seeking to accomplish anything other than enclosure and facilitation. Put more plainly, it just didn't set out to accomplish any of the right things, and was built with essentially no imagination. This is the story of all the multi-purpose cookie cutters.

By the time ground was broken on the south side of Chicago in 1989, things had been learned by everyone involved. New Comiskey would ultimately get only half of the equation right (being baseball-only), and it would take Camden Yards to bring imagination back to ballpark design. Suddenly, romance for the game was again part of the architecture, and a sense of the importance of place was fused with the importance of time (in the form of nostalgia).

CBP: retro in facade only

Not surprisingly, once the rest of baseball saw these ideas realized, a mad scramble was on. Every team wanted their own version of Camden Yards. The techniques of bludgeoning governments had been finely honed, and adding some level of design control was a natural next step.

But not every team had as much imagination as Baltimore. In fact, most teams went to the same architectural firm (HOK/Populous) and said in essence, "We want one of those."

Nostalgia then blossomed into its own design trend -- which we now call "retro" -- and took over the whole ballpark game. "Imagination" sort of ceased to be truly imaginative as engineers simply applied the new algorithms (brick, steel, arches, asymmetry, quirkiness) to each new geographic location.

To many, this was a wonderful occurrence. Indeed, it's a vast improvement over the previous generation of facilities.

But after a decade or so, some of the hollowness of the retro movement began to show. Despite looking (in passing) like the classic ballparks, they bore none of the integrated elements which had made those earlier parks truly classic. They were often set apart from their cities rather than integrated into them, and the separation of classes (which has been a part of ballpark design since the first fence went up in Brooklyn) went from incidental to brutal. In short, the new stadiums were retro in facade only.

Beyond that, while these new retro ballparks may not exactly look alike, they do sort of smell alike. The seating bowls bear striking resemblances to one another, and even when the details differ, many dimensions appear stamped from the same mold. Telling some of these apart in photographs can be a fun game.

TF: template-based?

It's almost as if a catalog of potential amenities was assembled, and clubs building new parks could just flip through the pages, fill out a form, indicate their own colors and the names of their own stars, make a few tweaks and be done. From the outside, building a ballpark began to look a little like eating at Old Country Buffet.

And over time it became clear that the engineers at HOK, who suddenly became apparently the only ballpark designers in the world (see the chart), have a distinctive way of solving problems. The quality of the finished product became more a function of how imaginative each team was able to be, and how much they were willing to require the architects to stretch to accomplish their ideas. In several cases, the imagination side of that equation just wasn't that good.

When the latest era is viewed in macro, it becomes tempting to call this batch of ballparks the "new cookie cutters", but that isn't quite fair. It's more like each project started from a common template, and the divergences are what pass for individuality.

It's an open question as to how history will view this era, which appears to be drawing to a close (four of the past seven ballparks have non-retro facades). But this is the landscape in which Target Field was designed and built. As such, one task in any review is to discern which of the "template traps" the designers fell into, and which were avoided.

In looking at that question, we can also try to figure out whether TF represents the end of one area, the beginning of another, or something else altogether.

Ah, Where to Begin...?

I think I started writing this review of Target Field about the time that the original designs were released and the model made public. But now that I'm trying to put it together, it's been tough to figure out just how to arrange everything.

Dave St. Peter introducing the first physical models of the ballpark in June 2007

So I've decided to return to an article I wrote back in 2003 for a predecessor web site, and republished here just a few weeks after the bill which would create Target Field was signed. In that article I tried to document what makes a great baseball place.

For those who have been following this site for any amount of time, you know that the ideas there actually represent the heart of what I think is important in a ballpark, and I've clung to them pretty closely throughout the past four years.

So, in broad categories, I'll look at Target Field now to see how it meets these criteria:

1. Respect for the game
2. Respect for the fans
3. Respect for the community
4. Respect for the franchise
5. Unique identity

These are the elements which I still believe go into the making of a great baseball place, and they are roughly in order of importance.

At the risk of giving away the ending, let me start right off by saying that I think Target Field is a beautiful baseball place.

Quick Plugs

Before I forget, if you haven't already done so, head on over to TwinsCentric.com to pick up a copy of the 2009-10 TwinsCentric Offseason Handbook. It's just been released, and I got my copy by email this morning and have started reading. It's just an awesome publication, and a reminder that this is a great time to be a Twins fan.

Also, be sure to check where you stand on the 2010 Playoff Challenge. It's fascinating just how wrong we can all be! Only two people got even one of the World Series teams correct. Next year we'll work out some sort of consolation round which will allow people to earn points by making secondary predictions.

Finally, as I publish my big review of the ballpark over the next few days, please use the comment section here to make your suggestions on what needs to happen with the ballpark during the offseason. The Twins brain trust will be meeting later this week, and your ideas might just find their way right to the people who can do something about them.

And thanks again for including this site in your first season experience of Target Field.

Next up: Respecting the Game

Comments


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Another great post, Rick. Can't wait to read the category details!

Posted on October 25, 2010 at 1:45 PM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 1

Rick: Easy, Anchor Fish & Chips in NE Mpls.

Posted on October 25, 2010 at 2:32 PM by Max Highlight this comment 2

Nicely done...I have goose bumps thinking back to all the fun I had at 30+ games this year.

Too bad it will take 165 days to be back for a Twins game, but at least I get to see some of my favorite beer vendors at other venues until then.

Posted on October 25, 2010 at 2:58 PM by tk Highlight this comment 3

Holy crap! Rick, I think we were all wondering what you had on the docket what with what felt like a few dozen pages of comments that we had accumulated on "Aftertaste," but you outdid yourself here! Nice work!

Posted on October 25, 2010 at 3:08 PM by theloniousjoe Highlight this comment 4

Suggestion #1:

*Have the ushers in the 300's make sure that no one approaches the railings at the stairs to look down at the field. There were many times someone would go up to the railing to look or take a picture, and would block the view of many people in the seating area above. I wish I could attack a picture, but I think you may know what I mean.

Suggestion #2:

*The metal railings that are along many of the sections, especially in the 300's, is there a way to replace these with sturdy plexi glass, as I have seen at other stadiums:Plex-glass minus the railing.

More to follow...

Posted on October 25, 2010 at 3:10 PM by tk Highlight this comment 5

I really enjoyed this article Rick! Good insight into the the ballparks over the years!

Posted on October 25, 2010 at 4:40 PM by The Sooj Highlight this comment 6

Also got the twins centric book, gonna print it at work. I work at kinkos, i can prob give people some deals on printing it out, if they mention they are on the site.

Posted on October 25, 2010 at 4:47 PM by The Sooj Highlight this comment 7

great stuff as usual rick. look forward to reading your analysis.

btw - the twins "brain trust", if they can rightfully be called that, need to worry a whole lot more about the product on the field and just a little bit less about every little gimmic dealing with the stadium. they should worry less about "publicly" letting everyone know they are "interested" in hearing their thoughts on the ballpark. try put a true championship winning product on the field first and worry a whole lot less about chinsy non-baseball related stuff dealing with stadium operations.

Posted on October 25, 2010 at 5:06 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 8

Not up to the Twins brain trust, but hosting the NHL Winter Classic (Wild vs. Avs, Canucks, or Stars?) would be great.

Posted on October 25, 2010 at 6:31 PM by James Highlight this comment 9

yeah that's one thing i was looking forward to as we watched the construction. The day the NHL Classic is played in Mpls!

Posted on October 25, 2010 at 6:35 PM by The Sooj Highlight this comment 10

Well the Wild brain trust will have to get their act together if they ever plan on hosting the Winter Classic in front of a national audience.

Posted on October 25, 2010 at 7:12 PM by MattW Highlight this comment 11

Great post Rick.
I liked the ballpark list you had up there. I think we should change our abbreviations though: NYS denotes New Yankee Stadium around here, but I liked your interpretation better, I think we should use FYS from now on: Fake Yankee Stadium.

Posted on October 25, 2010 at 7:33 PM by luke Highlight this comment 12

My suggestion to the Twins' "brain trust" is to win a post-season series someday.

Posted on October 25, 2010 at 8:57 PM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 13

I have previously posted this, but they need to improve some of the signage around TF, specifically section signs and restroom signs.

The sections are marked very poorly and with the large crowds standing in the concourse at the top of the sections (main concourse), its even more difficult to find your way to the section, and the correct side of the section (higher number seats, lower number seats). There are tiny signs on the railings behind the WC rows, but you can't see them when people are standing in front of them...There could a way to hang some signs underneath the overhang to better designate the section.

There are some concession stand issues that need to be worked on as well. Especially some of the "seasonal" items. Do they really need so many "north shore creamery" or "Frankie V" concession stands?? Either add more traditional fare to those stands or consolidate them to help out the busier stands such as Hennepin Grille and Mill City Grill.

Also, there has to be ways to help traffic flow in the area of gate 34/29 and the Majestic Twins clubhouse store and escalators.

Posted on October 25, 2010 at 9:02 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 14

Don't worry Mike. I just heard Jesse Crain signed a three-year deal with Hennepin Grille. That should help with the long lines. He'll be a great asset as he is an expert at "serving 'em up."

Posted on October 25, 2010 at 9:13 PM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 15

Would think they would play that NHL classic @ TCF Bank stadium not TF. Just saying!

Posted on October 25, 2010 at 10:18 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 16

I will look forward to the followup posts Rick. My first reaction, though, is...would the "Best" ballpark have sightlines that are easily blocked by someone of only slightly above average height in front of you, and restrooms with the doors turned the wrong way?

I'm not trying to be critical, but trying to determine how we know if this is "the best".

Posted on October 25, 2010 at 11:36 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 17

JCTwins,

I totally agree. I am not too sure who measured the distance between rows, but they are definitely among the smallest I have seen in any stadium I have been to, including my high school bleachers.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 01:09 AM by TK Highlight this comment 18

Greatness is in the eye of the beholder. I hit PNC Park, Citizens Bank Park, Orioles Park at Camden Yards, Kauffman Stadium, Busch Stadium, Coors Field, & Chase Field this season. Target Field is probably Top 5, but definitely not No.1 in my book. All depends on what is important to each person when ranking them. Completely subjective....

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 01:38 AM by Max Highlight this comment 19

All ballparks are template based. You take a field and put stands around it. From there you look at ways to make it unique to the city. Lets face it, unless Boston decides to replace Fenway there are not going to be anymore extremly oddly shaped fields. You will get your quirks, like the hangover at TF or the hill in Houston (Which would actually be awesome if it wasnt a 60 degree slope up.).

I know everyone says brick ballparks have been done to death, including the Saints, but if the Saints get a new ballpark in St. Paul, I hope they do, hopefully it looks better than the crap they proposed. Here is a picture if you click my name.

I dont know if this is getting off topic a bit, but I would have a few suggestions to make TF better.

1. Add more color to the stadium. Once you get above the first deck every thing, except the seats, is silver and gray. It looks very cold, industrial, metrodome like.

2. Have the same basic fare at everyone consession stand. One shouldn't have to walk to 3 different stands to find the hot dog they want.

3. Lowering the price of beer/food/booze would be great, but I don't expect that. I am a little weary of going to games next year because I end up spending too much money on food and drink, before and during the game. Plus I upped to a full season pack so it may be a pricey summer.

4. Move the fruit stand, gelato stand, and merchandise stand away from the right field corner, they just create congestion.

5. Does anyone know how much space is behind the wood paneling on the right field wall? I think it would be awesome if they got ride of that and added some seats down there.

6. Stop using 1/3 of the replay screen for line-up and scoreboard. If you are going to show a replay use the whole screen, then put up the stats back up. Showing more replays would be nice too.

Those are just some of my thoughts some realistic, some not.

One last thing. Sorry Rick, but it is not Fake Yankee Stadium. It's Yankee Stadium. Call the other one Old Yankee stadium or Historic Yankee Stadium. It is just nice they kept the name, would you rather it be MetLife Field or AIG Diamond?

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 02:34 AM by Duffman Highlight this comment 20

My chief issue is that I do not believe the promises we heard in regard to seating comfort were realized --- I think we got bait and switched. And, although I am not a member of the "class" I refer to, I feel badly for the folks who are paying for this palace yet can not afford to visit it. Finally, no ballpark named for some corporate entity will ever have a soul - and a ballpark really ought to have a soul.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 07:16 AM by Ben Highlight this comment 21

I agree Ben. Let's get rid of the naming rights and make tickets even more expensive for the average Minnesota fan to attend a game.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 07:24 AM by clublevelfan Highlight this comment 22

It's possible to run a baseball organization without squeezing the last nickel out of everything - it's been done before. The game itself used to have a soul - I wonder if that is any longer the case. What's next --- "urinal cakes sponsored by _____ "?

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 08:56 AM by Ben Highlight this comment 23

Urinal cakes with the visiting teams' logo on them. ;-)

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 09:59 AM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 24

Duffman bring your own food to the park. Check out the $1.00 dogs @ the Holday station next door! LOL! Plus you can smuggle some rum in also.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 10:38 AM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 25

TwinkFan,

Yeah, there was this guy in the HPB that I saw at a couple games this year that smuggled his rum in through a binocular flask. I wonder how long it will be until we have to disassemble our cameras to prove there is no alcohol :)

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 10:57 AM by tk Highlight this comment 26

Anchor Fish and Chips is not only the best fish and chips in the cities, they are the best I have ever had anywhere. That is including when I had them in England. I live in NE, and rave about The Anchor to anyone who will listen.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 11:48 AM by HebrewHammer16 Highlight this comment 27

One improvement has just been announced. The front row seats in the Legend Club will be slightly elevated, and rail will be replaced by glass at bottom of each stairwell. The height of the railings has been a hindrance to some. I assume that it is not the rail all the way along the Club area, but just at the bottom of the stairwells. Maybe they were an obstruction to people at the bottom with aisle seats?

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 12:00 PM by robin Highlight this comment 28

Call me a troll or whatever, but TF is not the best of the ballparks. Is it nice? Very. Is it technologically advanced? Sure. (though what's with the paper towel dispensers? get some of those high-powered hand dryers!) But it's missing that -- something -- that aura that you're now on special ground. I suppose time and history has something to do with that, but I felt that immediately the first time I was at Wrigley. It wasn't something that grew on me. It's like a fragrance in the air. It settles on your skin and in your lungs. Maybe TF will be that someday, but right now it is little more than the Hennepin County Library down the street. Angles and glass and limestone + Punto.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 12:56 PM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 29

I think the best ballpark is PNC Park...its just too bad that the Pirates are such a terrible team on an annual basis because they have the best ballpark in baseball. I was at the Twins-Pirates series in 2006 and this ballpark is just a great simple ballpark. (Target Field is still a top-5 ballpark in baseball.)

PNC Park is a very traditional and simple 2-deck design right along the river with the Roberto Clemente Bridge acting as our "Target Plaza"

If the Pirates were at all a competitive team, you would hear a lot more about their ballpark being the great ballpark that it is.

Unfortunately, when only 12,000 fans (just a guess) show up each night, the ballpark loses the atmosphere and appeal and as a result, does not get the attention it deserves.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 2:06 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 30

Bill Shannon, co-author of The Ballparks, the first definitive ballpark book, has died in a house fire.

It's notable here because a quote from his book has appeared at the top of my home page since day one, and his writing has always guided my thinking about ballparks.

RIP, distant fellow ballpark geek.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 3:05 PM by Rick 31

A story from a Miami TV station on the construction progress at the new Marlins ballpark. I know it's much hated around here, but I think it could be all right and capture the feel of Miami.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 3:33 PM by Buffalo Highlight this comment 32

TTH is on to something. They NEED to get rid of the stupid tension pull paper towel things in the bathroom. They have that stupid twist thing on the side that doesn't work worth a crap and then you pull on the towels and it tears and everyone is waiting in line behind you...STOP the madness! Go with the no-touch kind, or better yet the good old fashioned push and cranks! (No air dryers, they suck, even though they are environmentally friendly).

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 4:31 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 33

"Check out the $1.00 dogs @ the Holday station next door!"

Hey TwinkFan, do you own or manage that Holiday station? You plug it a lot here, and I was wondering...

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 5:55 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 34

robin -- Do have a link to the announcement re Legends Club changes? What will elevating the seats in the first row do to people sitting in row 2,3, etc.?

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 6:14 PM by msp Highlight this comment 35

the nhl winter classic game (along with a minnesota gophers outdoor hockey game) belongs in the gophers football stadium on the U of M campus in mpls. target field would be a horrible location for hockey. i would not go to the game if it were hosted at target field. watching hockey in target field (or any baseball stadium for that matter) would be lame and a waste of money. horrible sightlines and just not the right place for hockey.

the wild and the nhl are clueless and out of touch if they host it anywhere other than the gopher football stadium in minneapolis.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 6:19 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 36

The Winter Classic was awesome at both Wrigley and Fenway.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 6:51 PM by Rick 37

i think it would be cool at Target Field. Plus we should at some point, over the years every team should get a chance.

Did anyone notice the page numbers on the table of contents are off from what they are in the book? It was the player report card Arbitration Eligibles to the end that were off. Not that is matters, just be nice so i can skip to w/e section easily

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 7:20 PM by The Sooj Highlight this comment 38

MSP, I was wondering about the 2nd and 3rd rows myself, but I doubt it is a problem. I believe the Club area is sloped more than some of the field and diamond box areas, being a smaller and elevated section. The first row rail was a minor annoyance to some, a bigger deal to others, and many didn't even think about it, or quickly adapted. I don't have a link, but it was a very short item and I can quickly quote the relevant portion. "By the time we start the 2011 season, we will have slightly raised all front row seats in the Legends Club. In addition, we are installing glass in place of the railings at the bottom of each stairwell within the Legends Club seating bowl. The added seat elevation - coupled with the glass installation - should ensure that you and your guests enjoy better views of the action on the field."
Does that sound like glass will be at the bottom of the aisles, between rows, but not within the rows?

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 8:21 PM by robin Highlight this comment 39

follow up thought on a comment for the last thread - I have to take exception with the thought that the Rockies got crushed by an East coast powerhouse in 2007.

First - two of the games were a lot closer than most people remember. It is unfortunate that the Sox won 4-0, but (other than the first game), it wasn't like the Rockies didn't show up.

Second - I believe the outcome would have been VERY different if MLB had not changed the post-season that year to add all the ridiculous time off between series. The Rockies had *eight days* off - this isn't freakin' football - eight days without real play is going to derail everything.

The 2007 Rockies were a great story that MLB figured out a way to screw up. And if Cleveland could have just put Boston away in the ALCS, it would've been much better for baseball.

(PS - I'm disappointed the Twins aren't in the WS, but sure glad NY and Philly aren't)

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 8:49 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 40

Great article Rick.

I'd question calling Coors Field "retro", but that's a small complaint (and you should note that Coors is just about as integrated with the city's downtown area as you can possibly get (and is giving credit for revitalizing an entire area).

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 8:58 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 41

Coors is most definitely retro in design:


But it's also correct that Coors has had a neighborhood impact far beyond its walls.

"this isn't freakin' football - eight days without real play is going to derail everything"

Is it just me, or does anybody else feel like the season is already over? I have to keep reminding myself that there are at least four more games to be played.

One way to shorten the postseason -- or at least potentially shorten it, is to schedule everything after the first round on the fly based on when the various series finish up. I know, the TV people would scream and holler, but by all rights, game 1 of the World Series should have been last night (one travel day after the final team was determined).

Also, I heard talk today about shortening the regular season, lengthening the first round of the playoffs, and adding more wild card teams.

Frankly, the whole article made me want to puke. Absolutely none of these ideas sound good to me, while all of them sound inevitable in some fashion.

This was the section that got me yelling at my computer:

"We have less (playoff) teams than any other sport," (Selig) said last month. In the NFL, 12 of 32 teams make the playoffs. In the NBA and NHL, 16 of 30 teams advance to the postseason.

That's exactly what we don't need: further irrelevance of regular season games, further dilution of the quality of baseball in the playoffs, more fluky ways in which some team can win it all.

Just how is it that Bud Selig somehow always finds a way to do the exact opposite of what is good for the game?

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 9:32 PM by Rick 42

Buffalo,

Thanks for the Marlins link. For the record, I don't personally hate the Marlins ballpark at all. It's just that every time I get more information about it, I see missed opportunities everywhere.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 9:41 PM by Rick 43

Max,

I haven't tried Anchor Fish & Chips, so I'll have to find a way to get there for lunch soon.

Kieran's is pretty good, though it doesn't really come up to what I came to love in Scotland.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 9:45 PM by Rick 44

Robin,

Let's have a link!

These don't sound like particularly good ideas to me. Raising the first row of any section, though it could ease a railing problem, might also create a cascade of other problems. And I don't see the purpose of changing only the railings in front of the aisles.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 9:49 PM by Rick 45

TTH (and others),

I had also noticed that those paper towel dispensers always seem to jam or be broken or something. Seems like installing replacements might be to everyone's advantage.

I had also noticed that Nick Punto is still playing for the Twins. Seems like installing a replacement might be to everyone's advantage.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 9:55 PM by Rick 46

I was in Chicago this weekend and spent most of sat night drinking on the patio of Murphys blechers, staring at the back of Wrigleys scoreboard, it was raining lightly but me and my GF sat out there anyway cuz it was still too cool.. a cub fan was telling us there isa collage football game there next weekend and there was a dave matthews concert there a few weeks ago or somthing.. but then agian i was pretty drunk

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 10:11 PM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 47

I've seen a few articles like this floating around. The guy is from South Dakota, and came in to see the new park. Of Target Field, he says, "I'm not that impressed."

Unfortunately, he doesn't put too much behind his opinion. But I know some of you out there feel the same way. So, let's hear it. What were your disappointments in the facility?

Have no fear. Everyone will be nice.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 10:34 PM by Rick 48

Rick - I didn't realize you were talking retro for the exterior only. In that respect, Coors is retro - anything else would have stuck out like a sore thumb in LoDo. I don't see how anyone would consider the inside retro.

As for the recent comments by the player's union head about possible playoff changes for 2012 - you are absolutely right - they are unbelievably stupid. *Maybe* expand the DS to 7, but get rid of most of the off-days in the PS (see 2007 rant), bring back the traditional doubleheaders a few times a year (with a concession to having separate admissions), bring back the balanced schedule. Finish the season by the middle to end of October at the very latest. Going to playoff games and the World Series in freezing weather (literally) is no fun. And the 2011 "fix" of moving the season forward two weeks doesn't do anything except increase the chance of snow days for MLB.

And, after MLB does all that, consider a 154 game season. Every home team has at least 4 games a season that they'd rather forget - just eliminate them from the schedule in the first place.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 11:15 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 49

And, to the question posed by the article ... is TF the best park ever?

Because it is the newest, it automatically wins points. It is certainly one of the MLB top 5 (I also put PNC and Coors in that list, along with Camden Yards and PacBell).

The one thing it wins hands down is the best improvement over the previous park, taking that award away from the Seattle franchise. Going from the Metrodome to Target Field was such a 180 on so many levels that may have influenced some that think TF is the top park.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 11:21 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 50

As for biggest disappointment in TF - I would say seat pitch/height on the Lower (HPB) and LC levels, as pointed out by a previous poster. I'm 5' 7" and I found myself leaning to look around the person in front of me much more than I like. I've been in a lot of other ballparks and TF just seemed so much more "off" in that respect.
The Lower Level is hampered by the elevation offset between the moat and everything else and I don't know how you fix that after the fact.

This is ABSOLUTELY my biggest complaint - I love all the other stuff in the park, but I'm there primarily to watch a game, not shop, eat, whatever, though I always eat :)

I'll also second the comment about rails being in the way - if I paid a front row premium almost anywhere in TF, I'd be upset. They really do need to look at the plexiglass (and for more than just at the end of the stairways).

My other big gripe is traffic flow, especially if you enter at 29 or 34. It's almost as if they didn't realize 90% of the fans would enter through one of these gates.

Minor gripes - bathroom design / layout (some of that has been fixed) and section signs, echoing some comments above.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 11:33 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 51

Someone just forwarded me the complete message which went out to the Legends Club members yesterday:

October 25, 2010

Dear Legends Club Season Ticket Holder,

We are please to share with you some enhancements we are making to your Legends Club seat location for the 2011 Season. By the time we start the 2011 season, we will have slightly raised all front row seats in the Legends Club. In addition, we are installing glass in place of the railings at the bottom of each stairwell within the Legends Club seating bowl.

The added seat elevation – coupled with the glass installation – should ensure that you and your guests enjoy better views of the action on the field. We value you as a Legends Club Member and hope this will add to your overall Legends Club experience at future Twins games.

As always, if you have any questions or comments regarding your season ticket account, please contact your Ticket Sales and Service Representative directly or call the VIP Season Ticket Holder Phone Line at 612-XXX-XXXX.

Your Twins Ticket Sales and Service Team

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 11:37 PM by Rick 52

rick - the winter classic at wrigley and fenway was, imo, "just okay" and that was only because it was at wrigley and fenway. any other baseball stadium and i think the reviews and tv ratings would have been/will be SIGNIFICANTLY less....SIGNIFICANTLY. let's slow down a bit before some start trying to put target field in the same class as fenway & wrigley. personally, i think that is a silly comparison.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 11:52 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 53

also, i have read/heard from many that the sightlines, etc. were terrible at wrigley & fenway for the nhl winter classic games held there. people were only willing to put up with the absurdity of it because of the long history and storied nature of each ballpark. most people were there more for the so-called "experience" of hockey in the two old ballparks rather than to watch a hockey game in any true fashion.

Posted on October 26, 2010 at 11:55 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 54

Mazarati, Illinois and Northwestern play at Wrigley Field on November 20th. I was thinking about getting rooftop seats for it ($250 a pop) but decided against it because I will be flying back there the Wednesday after for Thanksgiving. My family lives near Chicago and I am an Illini fan. It will be on ABC though at 2:30 that day for anyone who wants to check it out.

Betaband, you're an idiot if you're saying that the winter classic at TF would be horrible. NHL wouldn't allow the Winter Classic to be hosted at a place that doesn't even serve beer. Economic impact would be bigger too in downtown Minneapolis, since there is more capacity for fans in bars/restaurants there.

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 09:12 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 55

TF is definitely getting these rave reviews because people are subconsciously comparing it to the dome. I don't think they even realize it. I have to say after attending games at Busch, Jacobs (Progressive), and Kaufmann last year, they are all comparable to TF in terms of watching the game, and as far as I recall, the concession/restroom experience.

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 09:31 AM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 56

Wouldn't it be nice if fan behavior influenced Lee to stay away? Clicky, Clicky...

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 10:10 AM by N.D. (aka N.D. "Rube") Highlight this comment 57

Pat Meares -- TCF Bank Stadium provides at least 10,000 more seats than TF ever would for the NHL Winter Classic, not to mention, I am sure they can find a "temporary permit" to sell alcohol there for that special event.

If the NHL cared about surrounding bars/restaurants so much, than why did they have the Winter Classic in Orchard Park, NY a few years ago...essentially a stadium in the middle of nowhere...

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 10:40 AM by Mike Highlight this comment 58

Any full season STH here that have NOT received their 2011 invoice package?

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 11:25 AM by jfh Highlight this comment 59

jfh,

Are you talking about the informational packet?

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 11:52 AM by tk Highlight this comment 60

N.D.

Yes that would be nice, but I think both he and his wife will be more-than-willing to forgive once the Yankees offer a quarter-of-a-billion dollars over 10 years.

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 12:16 PM by Expectorate Highlight this comment 61

Interesting write-up, Rick.

A few comments:

I don't buy the template criticism - particularly as it relates to the seating bowl. Every ballpark has a template - it's called the field. I just find this to be an empty criticism.

Regarding integration into cities - this is certainly true, but that has everything to do with how we build cities now, and has little to do with how we build stadiums. Old parks like Wrigley and Fenway pre-date zoning codes, for example.

Regarding retro parks feeling bland and HOK's rut - this isn't really different from any other kind of building. The architect builds what the client wants. That rule applies to everything from office buildings to ballparks. Some clients work well with designers to produce something unique, while others give the architects all the latitude and get something crazy and almost unusable, while other clients are too controlling and you get something bland and unimaginative.

I'd also take issue with you calling the cookie cutter parks uncreative. Unimaginative might be better from a user's perspective, but at the same time, those multi-use parks have some quite imaginative solutions to dealing with very real challenges of the use program - moving seats, etc.

Also - as for why the multi-purpose era lasted so long, despite the known shortcomings - that's a simple answer. How many of those parks used public money? Public money means it's a political decision, which means you need to address all of the public concerns. You note this, briefly - but that's the real cause. The public's concerns are more broad than any one team, therefore they're going to look for multi-purpose solutions. And they do save money - just look at the combined costs for Target Field and a proposed Vikings stadium with a roof - and compare that to the Metrodome plus 30 years of inflation and perhaps some design upgrades.

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 12:25 PM by Alex B. Highlight this comment 62

Yes while TCF does allow more seating, they would not be able to get a temporary permit for alcohol at the game.

Because the U of M Regents board is short sighted and would glady cut of their nose to spite their face, alcohol will not be served in the general seating areas of that stadium for any reaons.

The U2 concert that was supposed to be here last year, and was bumped to July of this year, was to be and will be alcohol free. If they are not going to allow alcohol at and Irish band's concert they certainly are not going to allow it for an NHL game.

The only way alcohol will be served in TCF stadium is if the Vikings end up renovating the dome and are required to play there. If even then the U of M resists the NFL will probably have the Vikings play at Target Field.

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 1:12 PM by Duffman Highlight this comment 63

shortcomings.... in one sense, I feel that TF, while cool in many respects, swung and missed when it came to grandeur. Maybe that wasn't the architects' intent, but there seemed to be somewhat of a vacancy in the "wow factor" when you stop comparing it to the Metrodome. If it weren't for the Metropolitan Club and the celebration sign, limestone and a few other things, I think aesthetically it would be -- dare I say -- ho hum? Too much beige, stainless steel and Target brand red lettering? Maybe it's the (yawn) concession stand signage?

I do remember Rick alluding to this way back when, when he brought up something to the effect of tall columns (height) lacking in the mainframe architecture.... he might have a point. TF almost blends in TOO WELL into the surrounding environment.

just my two pennies. though I'm not complaining, as I re-upped my season tickets.

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 1:19 PM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 64

I'll agree with TTH's lack of "wow factor" comment.

Another suggestion-cover all of the gray cement facings with limestone or fake limestone like is on the wall under the retired numbers. That would make a HUGE difference in overall appearance.

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 1:36 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 65

Hey Rick... any way you could add "like" buttons to each post so that other readers could give them a thumbs up? (I'd suggest a dislike as well, but let's keep this positive...)

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 1:39 PM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 66

tk - I presume it's a package that was supposed to be mailed in September, with the invoice, details on payment options, and some other info. I ask because of the new disclaimer on the My Twins Ticket accounts:

"Please note: Only season ticket accounts who have been mailed a Twins renewal invoice statement for the 2011 season are eligible to renew or purchase season tickets for the 2011 season. If you are not in receipt of a 2011 renewal invoice, sent via a ground transportation delivery service or the postal service, then an offer to renew or purchase season tickets for the 2011 season has not been made by the Twins and you are not eligible to renew or purchase any season tickets using the My Twins Tickets tool or any other method. Please contact the Twins if you have any questions. "

I haven't received a renewal invoice via ground service, yet paid the invoice online prior to the due date, so I'm a little concerned, as I've never seen anything like that disclaimer in prior years.

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 1:49 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 67

One of the delights of TF is seeing the looks on the faces of people who have known no other baseball venue (I won't dignify it by calling it a "ballpark") than the Dome. It's like seeing someone who has been in a long-term abusive relationship and who, once out of that relationship, realizes how bad it was.

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 1:54 PM by terry Highlight this comment 68

As a friend said, when I quoted Bud Selig on the fact that MLB has less teams in the postseason than the NHL, NBA and NFL, "Precisely!"

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 5:44 PM by robin Highlight this comment 69

And another difference, if I have my facts right, that Bud will have to do something about, is the stubborn refusal of baseball teams to follow the home advantage script in the postseason. Correct me if I'm wrong, and forgive or ignore me if I'm obsessing on this, but I think the home teams are 10-17 this postseason, meaning they can only tie if the World Series follows the 87 and 91 patterns, of home teams winning every game. In the six series so far, the "home advantaged" team has actually had more home games than their opponent in only three of them, all divisional best-of-five series, and in only one of those, did they win the series (phillies). The Twins played 2 of three at home, and lost. Tampa played 3 of 5 at home, and lost. In fact the home team lost all five of that series.

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 5:52 PM by robin Highlight this comment 70

And another difference, if I have my facts right, that Bud will have to do something about, is the stubborn refusal of baseball teams to follow the home advantage script in the postseason. Correct me if I'm wrong, and forgive or ignore me if I'm obsessing on this, but I think the home teams are 10-17 this postseason, meaning they can only tie if the World Series follows the 87 and 91 patterns, of home teams winning every game. In the six series so far, the "home advantaged" team has actually had more home games than their opponent in only three of them, all divisional best-of-five series, and in only one of those, did they win the series (phillies). The Twins played 2 of three at home, and lost. Tampa played 3 of 5 at home, and lost. In fact the home team lost all five of that series.

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 5:54 PM by robin Highlight this comment 71

I've seen quite a few MLB ballparks and surprised nobody ever mentions Safeco...I loved it and Seattle was fantastic.

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 6:56 PM by Steve Highlight this comment 72

Oh...And waiting forever for the WS to start is bullshit.

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 6:57 PM by Steve Highlight this comment 73

Cheapest WS seats tomorrow $450/ticket

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 8:11 PM by TK Highlight this comment 74

I've been reading about the improvements to the LC. In regards to the railings being replaced by glass, that's just for the LC, right? They won't be doing that ballpark-wide?
As far as the WC being played at Wrigley and Fenway, I think it was more than merely just "OK." I think both events were done very well. I think TF will be a nice place for a WC. TCFBS will work too, and in the State of Hockey, you'd probably want the 50,000 seat football stadium over the 39,000 seat ballpark.

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 10:12 PM by luke Highlight this comment 75

duffman - there are a lot of incorrect statements in your last post. please study up next time before posting a bunch of fabricated half-truths and misconstrued information.

it is not the U of M regents problem. it is the fault and problem of a group of pandering, faux populist, socialist leaning (fools like rep. tom rukavina & rep. yvonne prettner solon) idiots in the minnesota legislature that are screwing up the alcohol policy situation in U of M on-campus sports facilities. they are sticking their noses into the business of an elected board of regents. it is not the minnesota legislature's business to selectively tell the U of M board of regents how to manage alcohol control & disburtion on THEIR campuses.

in case you didn't know (i am guessing you don't considering the lies and fabrication you wrote regarding the U of M regents position on the issue) the U of M (along with the rest of the big ten conference) do not allow alcohol sales in general/student seating areas of on-campus sports facilities due to the large presence of underage students. that has been the case for a long time. within the big ten (and virtually all of the NCAA) alcohol can only be sold in controlled and monitored premium seating areas of on-campus stadiums & arenas. it is not allowed in general seating where underage students are present. that is not going to change and it is not going to change at the U of M. and rightfully so. this practice (alcohol only in the controlled and monitored premium seating areas) was the case at williams and mariucci arenas for the longest time and was rightfully to be the case at tcf bank stadium when it opened. try and remember that the metrodome was not a U of M owned facility (they only leased the space) so they had literally no say in whether or not alcohol could be sold and where in that buidling on game days.

funny how alcohol policy was never an issue to the pandering, idiot fools in the minnesota legislature until tcf bank stadium was coming on-line. that same consistent plan (the same plan used in williams & mariucci for years & years) for alcohol sales at tcf bank stadium was told to the legislature in 2006 and they never raised a single concern about that long held policy until a couple months before it was to open (conveniently right before an election season). a bunch of political pandering b.s. by a group of useless politicians.

i am certain that the long time alcohol policy of the big ten (and ncaa for that matter) will eventually be the case at the U of M once again. alcohol has never been served in general/student seating in on-campus stadiums within the big ten due to the large presence of underage students and minnesota is not going to go against their conference policy on that matter. nor should they. in fact i am quite confident that the big ten alcohol policy and structure will once again be the case in U of M on-campus sports facilities come 2011.

rant over......

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 10:40 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 76

and did you really say that the nfl would tell the vikings to play at target field because of alcohol policy? ha! that is about as silly as it gets. come back to reality my man.

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 10:42 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 77

I just did some quick measuring, and I don't think it's even possible to squeeze a football field into TF. Maybe if you use warning tracks for part of the end zones...

As for alcohol at TCFBS, there has been some discussion that in the next session the Legislature may undo their meddling, and the U will be able to get back to booze-ness as usual.

I know the NCAA has these rules, but they just don't make any sense. The U has lots of students who are over 21. Students come with their parents. There is just a ton of money being left on the table.

And there are plenty of ways to make sure that alcohol isn't sold to minors. If I'm not mistaken, at every other sports facility in the whole entire world vendors have to check IDs.

Likewise, there is absolutely no way to make sure the motivated teenager doesn't drink. We've got people here (presumably not teenagers, but it doesn't matter) sneaking rum into TF in binocular flasks!

Our society is so screwed up on how it handles alcohol consumption, it's no wonder that the problems are legion.

Posted on October 27, 2010 at 11:24 PM by Rick 78

When the Bears played at Wrigley Field, a corner of the south endzone included the first base dugout steps. It was a pretty tight fit.

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 02:03 AM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 79

I think they may approve it into the legislation, and have the "Wally clause" added.

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 02:10 AM by TK Highlight this comment 80

Beta-

What lies and fabrications did I make up?

All the legislature did is said you can not limit beer sales to the private areas. Since the State for all intents and purposes owns the U, provides $700 million (1/3 the U's budget), and paid for the stadium, they have the right to tell the U of M regents what to do. The U of M campus does not belong to the Regents, it belongs to the state, on other words you, me and everyone else that lives in Minnesota.

I do not know what changed in the Regents attitudes between the metrodome and TCF but they did not used to have a problem with beer. When a team plays at the metrodome they lease the building and gets to choose what is sold there. You don't believe this? Then why are all the high school games alcohol free?

The regents need to drop the holy than thou attitude about beer and just sell it to the entire stadium. It is funny that they complain about the money they are losing by not being able to sell beer in the private suites, but fail to mention the money they are missing out on by not selling to the entire stadium.

Also stop worring about other college stadiums, and their policies, who cares what they do.

Having a few beers at a college football game is not the great evil the Regents make it out to be. In fact it probably makes the students drinking worse, since they will binge drink before the game and show up completely hammered. I know that is what we did before SCSU hockey games.

Rick the Vikings playing at TF is just a guess, since if they were not able to serve beer at TCF, they would look for somewhere else to play, it is just too big of a revenue stream.

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 04:54 AM by Duffman Highlight this comment 81

I had an enlightening conversation with a Twins exec today. It seems there will be some changes for 2011 that most everyone here will appreciate. Don't know if I should share the details, so all I will say for now is that my respect for the Twins organization in looking out for the best interest of true Twins and/or baseball fans has gone way up and I'm proud to be a season ticket holder and promote Twins baseball!

And - I don't ever want to see a football field on Target Field. Baseball only. No football, no hockey, no fancy concerts, just baseball. We have the Dome for the other stuff.

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 12:37 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 82

Duffman,

If the regents are being so obtuse, why is it that you can't buy a beer at Mariucci or at Williams unless you're in premium seating?

What's wrong with wanting that same model for TCF? The exact same model that's used in every other on-campus Big Ten venue that serves booze?

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 1:12 PM by Alex B. Highlight this comment 83

jfh, it seems unkind to publicly say you have heard some great things for the upcoming season at Target Field and that most everyone will appreciate these changes, but then state well...I don't know if I should share them with you. If you think these things shouldn't be mentioned or discussed here, then why bring the topic up in the first place?

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 2:14 PM by Jeff Highlight this comment 84

Jfh is it $2.00 beers and $1.00 dog days ahead next year?? Cmon man out with it!!!! LOL!

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 2:25 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 85

Alex-

Maricci and Williams no long serve alcohol is special seats, nor should they if it will not be provided to everyone. I am not a class-warfare guy, but honestly why should only people you pay more money get to have beer? If it is ok to sell it in some parts of the stadium, why not the entire stadium?

I fail to see the problem with serving beer in the general seating area. There can be ways to minimize the chance that underage students are getting booze, not that they are not bringing in flaskes and small bottles anyway.

Once again you bring up the rest of the Big 10. Why does this all of the sudden matter now that they are back on campus? It didn't bother anyone when they were at the metrodome.

On a similar note, the Regents need to change the way they look at the stadium. Whether it is how they cater to the Alums and money people more than students, or the lack of parking and tailgating areas around the stadium for STUDENTS. College football is supposed to be a fun experience to go to a game.

Now I have not gone to a game this year at TCF and it may have changed from last year, but from what I saw it wasn't that great of an experience.

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 2:35 PM by Duffman Highlight this comment 86

I agree Jeff -- if you don't think you should say anything regarding these "things" than why even bring up the topic in the first place?

I do know the Twins are going to get more aggressive with tickets on the "secondary" market, at least that is what I have heard through some people in the know. The Twins took a lot of criticism for how they handled the ticket inventory this year and they are going to try to control it better in 2011. I have even heard they are putting some limits on some STH accounts, presumably, some of the "broker" accounts who bought multiple groups of tickets and sold them on secondary markets.

This may help explain part of the "disclaimer" from the Twins that has been previously mentioned on this board.

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 2:43 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 87

Jeff - sorry for being vague in my post. I was really torn about commenting because it is unclear to me the extent to which the Twins want anything publicized. (And, if you recall, they didn't want me to post pictures of the Target Field sod or even the sod trucks).

However, Mike pretty much nailed the main issue in his post, so I'm not letting the cat out of the bag. I suspect those (especially with out of state accounts) that have tickets pretty much just for resale may have to find another way to spend their time in 2011, and, to me, that is a great thing. Using the secondary market reasonably is one thing; having tickets primarily to sell into the secondary market is another issue entirely. My account was affected by a unrelated database snafu (which has since been corrected), but, because my mailing address is out of state, it also fit a profile of interest.

The Twins certainly could have been more transparent in their communication about what was going on, but the bottom line is that did/are doing what I think is the right thing, and, in fairness, I suspect they didn't want to cause undue concern to the vast majority of STHs that aren't abusing the privilege of being an STH.

As it turns out, had it not been for an errant phone call, or if a few more days had past, I never known there was a potential issue. Aside from my blood pressure spiking for a few days because I was thinking that one of the people I share tickets with is an axe murder or did something really bad during a game, I'm good.

I'm very sorry to report that I cannot confirm rumors of $2 beers and $1 hot dogs ... :)

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 3:49 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 88

And, before anyone asks, I don't know what the criteria is (other than out of state being a factor); I just know I'm in the "good guy" category.

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 3:59 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 89

My suggestions for Target Field next year would be...

Improve the aesthetics of the main concourses. They are so bland with the cream/tan paint they used and the directional singage used. I feel as though I am shopping through a Target Store rather than at a ballpark.

The different clubs and bars have such a great connection to the Twins organization. They could use some of those excellent touches in the main concourse areas.

Improve the signage for the concessions. I hate when they use signs with pictures of food on them. The signs are worse than a mall food court. I feel like I'm back in elementary school in the cafeteria.
I remember old renderings with red awnings, something like that would be a nice touch.

Lower the concrete brick wall where the batters box is by a foot or so. There is probably a good reason it is that high (hitters), but if it can be lowered it would be nice.

Improve the lighting used for the topiaries and the wind veil. It would be great to see bright beams of light shooting up from the center signifying each inning instead of the LED lights that are not very visible.

A Twins Hall of Fame would be a great addition. Ford Center maybe?

Second video board on top of the Metropolitan Club and please change that obtrusive green backround color used on the video boards. It is not pleasing to me eye at all.

I'll stop there for now.

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 4:34 PM by Jeff Highlight this comment 90

Jeff - very nice observations. You're certainly right about the signage above the concession stands. I have thought since day 1 that they were unimaginative, uninspired and well, boring. Even the Field Fare stands at the other place had better signage.

I also like your suggestions about the topiaries. I feel that the entire plaza is poorly lit, at least on game days. Go back on the web cam (if it's still up) and check out some of the night pictures...there's lots of good lighting on the plaza, that I think was non-existent on game days.

Yes, I know that the 950 or so halogen lights that light TF overpower the plaza big time, but seriously, on TV, the plaza was so dark, TF looked like the only thing in downtown Minneapolis. I thought, harking back to something someone on here said LOOONG ago, I thought that one of those things were supposed to light up at the conclusion of every inning.

And, I know Target Center is boring as hell, but it wouldn't hurt the brass over there to turn on some of the exterior lighting for the place for God's sake.

What I think they need out there, might be hard finding a place to put it, but they need some sort of a neon sculpture out there, like San Fran's Coke bottle, or Citi Field's old school Pepsi sign. And, who knows, maybe with a new video board atop the Metropolitan Club, maybe that'll help a little...

I also thought that the wind veil was supposed to be lit at night. There are lights that shine on the thing, but I don't think they're very good. Get some good colored lights on it, and a decent wind, might look kinda cool. I wish I could have seen the wind veil a couple days ago with that fierce wind that was going nuts all day.

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 4:58 PM by luke Highlight this comment 91

I didn't always go out that way, but I don't ever remember the wind veil *not* being lit. However, the plaza lighting in general can certainly use an improvement. The bright beams of light sound cool, though local residents may not like the idea so much.

Change the green color on the video background - agree!

A Twins HOF was originally considered for inclusion at TF, but there was not enough room. And one of the reasons for buying the Ford center was apparently to do a HOF.

Regarding "The different clubs and bars have such a great connection to the Twins organization. They could use some of those excellent touches in the main concourse areas. " - how do you do that without impeding traffic flow? The main concourse has some serious traffic bottlenecks already on most days.

A neon sculpture? *shudder* For obvious reasons, a Coke sign would never happen, but it's a baseball park, not an amusement park.

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 6:01 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 92

duffman - you are still stating lies and misconstruing the information.

no, the taxpayer did not pay for the gophers football stadium as you are falsely implying. it was paid for mostly by private donations by U of M alums, gophers athletic boosters and corporate partners like tcf, best buy, target, general mills, dairy queen, cargill, etc. the portion that the state applied to the new gopher football stadium came from a transfer of U of M owned land over to the state of minnesota. said another way, it was basically a land-swap between the U of M and the state. there was NOT a single red cent of money raised directly from the taxpayer (unlike everyone's holier than thou target field) for construction of the new gopher football stadium.

so imo, yes the U of M regents should have and deserve to have control over alcohol policy and distribution on THEIR campus and in their ON-CAMPUS sports facilities. they should not have pandering, idiotic, socialist legislators (rep. tom rukavina)

and as alex b. said. it is funny how alcohol only in controlled and monitored premium seating areas in ON-CAMPUS williams & mariucci arenas (a policy that had been in place for years at those on-campus facilities) was never a problem for this group of pandering, fake-ass, socialist (rep. tom rukavina) politicians.

the ON-CAMPUS (again stop with an incorrect and baseless comparison to how the metropolitan sports facilities commission people ran the metrodome, a facility the U of M had no control over when it came to alcohol policy) gophers football stadium is about to open ON-CAMPUS and suddenly a group of pathetic, pandering, political whackos feels the need to unfairly and unjustly hold it and its revenue capacity hostage as a cheap and unfair political tool. to me, that is a bunch of B.S. and it is extremely unfair to the U of M and the U of M regents to be jerked around like that by some political nutjobs.

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 6:19 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 93

One I haven't seen here in the last few days since we started posting recommendations...

Build a platform behind that centerfield wall that's too damn high!

I still think they need to have digital signs for the concessions like they have at the movie theater so they can rearrange them during the season or during the game. Ice cream vs. hot dogs for example.

Move the stands along the concourse down the right field line where it's crowded. It makes no sense because those are all movable stands.

Agree on plaza lighting, it is currently lame.

That's great if they kill the professional out of staters...again hopefully that frees up some space in the better seating for the rest of us to improve.

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 6:28 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 94

Maybe the Twins got data from Stubhub of tickets that were sold more than x times per season, then they were cross-referenced with out of state addresses?

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 6:29 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 95

JCTwins - all clubs and MLBAM have access to data for both the buyer and seller for each of their StubHub sales, so they can certainly do that.

I hope it does free up space for others to improve ... but, as someone pointed out to me, what if the club increases their inventory for the secondary market, effectively capturing the additional revenue now being made by brokers? We've all seen block of tickets appear on SH that seem to be from the club (e.g. entire rows at a time).

I hope they are considering things like extended variable pricing, much like the Giants do today. Dynamically adjust pricing based on record, weather, opponent, etc. (for walk ups, not STH) - if the Twins are doing well and playing Boston on a Saturday, charge more then if they are battling the Royals for last place on a damp Wednesday evening. This not only captures additional revenue in a truer "market value" pricing, but also provides an additional financial incentive to field a winning team.

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 6:41 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 96

Agreed JFH...let's hope they let us improve, and then use the balance of STH inventory to do what you're referring to.

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 7:26 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 97

jfh, yes I know those main concourses have serious traffic issues, but I would really like to see those areas spruced up. It just seems to be missing something.

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 9:10 PM by Jeff Highlight this comment 98

Ballpark Authority has a playoff picture update. Click my name for the new pics.

Posted on October 28, 2010 at 9:12 PM by Jeff Highlight this comment 99

Jeff,

Thanks for sharing the link. I got to the Valencia walk and then I could not watch anymore :(

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 01:40 AM by TK Highlight this comment 100

Beta-

U of M is run by the state, the state paid taxpayer money to the U for state owned land. Whether you want to play semantics with where the money came from is up to you. Bottom line is that state paid money for that stadium, meaning taxpayers paid for that stadium. Since you choose to believe it differently, there is no sense in continuing this conversation, because we would be arguing over sematics. Rebut all you want, I am done with it.

That being said I apologize to everyone else on the board for hijacking it for something non-related to baseball or TF.

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 02:53 AM by Duffman Highlight this comment 101

I will agree Target certainly seemed to have a huge influenceon parts of that ballpark with the red signs and the Target logos everywhere. Do other ballparks that have sponsers look alot like the companies that have the naming rights just curious. Also if any changes or improvements happen at Target Field who has the final say the Twins, the ballpark authority or the county. I would guess if people want improvements and stuff I would think it would be best to deal with whoever has the most power of the situation which from what I have read here so far would be the Twins. But the ballprk authority and the county are investors as well so you would think they would listen to anything that could improve their investment as well.

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 05:12 AM by Leroy Highlight this comment 102

I think the Rangers stole the Twins' "How to beat the Yankees" playbook...

I've only been listening on the radio (stuck at work last last night), are the Rangers just that lost in the World Series??

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 08:36 AM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 103

F_T_K,

All I can think about is how lost Vladimir Guerrero looked out in right field Wednesday night, and how much less potent the Rangers look overall without a DH.

Obviously, the Giants are pitching very well and the Rangers aren't, but should a team really have to compete at this level in a way they haven't had to compete all season long? Should they have to compete in a way they were not designed to compete?

Nolan Ryan came out yesterday in favor of dumping the DH altogether -- for both leagues. I think that's unlikely. But why, oh why, can they not just standardize the whole sport one way or the other?

True to form, Bud Selig said in an interview yesterday that the subject isn't even among those he's been talking to teams about. Instead, he's trying to expand the playoffs for next year.

Oh, Bud, how can we miss you if you won't go away?

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 09:48 AM by Rick 104

Other TF improvements:

In the upper deck there are a few issues that could all be resolved with one improvement.
- on hot, muggy evenings the moths become a problem as they swoop down from the lights up in the canopy.
- on colder days, the wind can really put a chill in you that isn't felt at lower levels, especially in the concourse.
- there are times when the glare from the setting sun shines off of the skyline buildings and makes it really hard to see the field without shielding your face.

To solve these problems, I'd suggest some sort of permanent overhead teflon structure. It would eliminate the bugs, there would be no glare and the temperature would be constant.

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 09:52 AM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 105

Just what we need...more playoff teams...if there is going to be expanded playoffs, than ELIMINATE the unbalanced schedule...how about eliminate the unbalanced schedule altogether and seed the division winners 1-3 with the wild card playing the best division winner REGARDLESS of DIVISION...

That's whats unique about baseball is that only four teams do make the postseason.

It's already pathetic in the NBA and NHL (with half of the league in the playoffs) as well as NCAA Football when a 6-6 team can make a "Bowl" game.

As long as the almighty dollar prevails....we will continue to see these trends in sports as sad as that is.

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 10:02 AM by Mike Highlight this comment 106

The Target logo'ing is NOTHING compared to CitiField. Almost impossible to know the Mets play there.

Regarding Mr. Selig - I'm not going miss him, even when he is gone.
Any benefit of the doubt I gave him was gone when he refused to correct the perfect game screw up this year.

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 10:53 AM by jfh Highlight this comment 107

I posted this in the last blog entry, but since it's more at home in this one, here it is again.

Looking strictly at the ballpark itself, there are a few wrinkles I'd like to see smoothed out in 2011. None of these are fatal flaws and may not be a big deal to the Twins organization or other fans, but they all struck me as things that could be improved upon.

- The concession lines on the lower deck between the bases often extended so far out into the concourse that they blocked traffic. The Twins could alleviate this by using stanchions to direct the lines out of traffic and keep things flowing.

- Some of the specialty concession stands, namely the Viola and Berenguer themed Italian and Latino kiosks, seemed underused. The Twins could solve this in one of three ways. 1.) Improve the fare at those stands to encourage more customers. 2.) Increase the product mix at those stands to include traditional baseball food and thus lighten the load on overtaxed stands offering those products. 3.) Eliminate the specialty nature of those stands and rebrand them as general concession stands, but still with a few specialty items. When you have a Hennepin Grill stand featuring lines 10 people long and a Senor Smokes stand with concession workers just standing around due to a lack of business, it's time to make some sort of change.

- The crush by the escalators inside the Carew gate needs to be addressed in some way. I'm not sure how. The crowd of people moving in conflicting directions and the resulting traffic jam causes some real safety issues at worst and at best is mighty inconvenient.

- On that note, it seems like so many fans enter via the Puckett and Carew gates that it in part leads to the crush mentioned above. I'm not sure how you do this without seeming heavy handed, but it might be wise to strongly encourage fans to walk around the perimeter of the park to enter via gates that put them closest to their seats instead of entering the first gate they encounter and then having to make a more time consuming journey through congested concourses.

- More mounted TVs on and around the Captain Morgan Deck. That area seems like it was far more popular than anticipated. There's always a big crowd, but the field is hard to see unless you're right at the rail, so give folks a few more TVs to keep an eye on.

- Unless I missed it, the concourse that serves the middle and upper tiers of the left field grandstand lacks a souvenir stand. You have to travel down to the New Era shop on the main level in the left field corner for such things. Although it's not a very long journey, it's still inconvenient, especially for families with small kids. A temporary stand, as opposed to a walk in shop, would be helpful and probably increase the per capita take on souvenirs.

- Make sure the roving vendors hike up to the 300 level more often. It seems like too often they're content to pop down to the 200 level seats or just park in the upper concourse instead of walking up another flight to take care of fans in the upper most seating deck.

- Put the 1987 and 1991 World Series Championship trophies on display in an area visible to all fans. It always irked me that the Twins kept them in their lobby at the Dome, but at least anyone who wanted to could come take a look and a photo. Now they're hidden away in the Champions Club where only a select few get to see them unless they take the guided tour during a non game time. Let everyone have a look in a more public space.

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 11:13 AM by Jorge Highlight this comment 108

Looks like Kubel will be back and Punto is gone next season, according to Kelly Thesier.

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 11:17 AM by Grizzly Adams Highlight this comment 109

Well maybe Nick comes back with a huge discount. Kinda suprised on Kubel. What does this mean for Delmon?. Could use a right hand band. Gonna be an interesting few weeks coming up. Lots of questions!

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 12:03 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 110

Why would it mean anything for Delmon? They can afford Kubel and Delmon. I do agree that the OF is pretty weak with Young/Span/Cuddyer/Kubel in it, but I don't see them getting rid of anyone. I hope they can trade Kubel for something useful, like a good 2B, but I doubt it...which is why I don't think any of those guys will be gone.

If Kubes is going back to primary DH, we definitely need to platoon him with someone who can hit lefties. Thames would be nice because he can be another backup OF & 1B.

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 12:23 PM by AJ Highlight this comment 111

Thome gone then if they keep Kubel and Young?

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 12:32 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 112

duffman - the U of M is run by an elected board of regents and the president. it is not run by the state as you imply.

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 12:33 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 113

I could see Thome gone. It really depends on how much money he wants.

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 1:51 PM by AJ Highlight this comment 114

1) The regents are named to the board by the state, (governor or legislature, but not by popular vote like Soil & Water Boards, City Councils, etc.)
2) A big chunk of money for operating the U is appropriated by the state legislature.
3) In both cases, the U of M is run by the state.
4) For crying out loud. Let. It. Go.

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 3:32 PM by fiesta Highlight this comment 115

I agree. Move along. It got tiresome quite a while back.

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 4:20 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 116

What I would like to see is the Grain Belt sign be restored and placed on the Target Center, but I'm sure our friends at Budweiser, (ish), would object and there is not enough money in it for the Timberwolves to replace T. Denny's sign.

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 4:22 PM by Trebor651 Highlight this comment 117

The Grain belt sign is a landmark right where it is. It'll never move.

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 7:58 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 118

I knew I forgot something...the green scoreboard overlay.
I know where they were going with it...trying to get that old-school, hand-operated Wrigley/Fenway look, and the worst part is it's not just the scoreboard itself, it's integrated into the OT scoreboard plus the ribbon boards on the lower fascia.
Safeco did something similar with their OT scoreboard (click my name for a pic)and I think it looks better than TF's. I think the problem with TF's is that it's a bright color green. The overlay at Safeco looks much more realistic.
What's really cool about Safeco's is that they've designed it so that when the numbers change, they fade out to black briefly, to create the illusion that it's hand operated. I wish ANC Sports still had the video up that demonstrated that, it was pretty cool.

Posted on October 29, 2010 at 9:54 PM by luke Highlight this comment 119

Of Course the Grain Belt sign stays!

Posted on October 30, 2010 at 03:45 AM by The Sooj Highlight this comment 120

In terms of a ballpark what would make it a classic. Wrigley and Fenway are classics but would any other ballparks around today ever get called that. And anytime you open a new ballpark I suppose people are going to say its great just like when the Marlins ballpark opens eventually people are going to say its the best around. I will say this about Target Field it does have a Twins baseball history all over and A Twins museum would make that even better.

Posted on October 30, 2010 at 05:22 AM by Leroy Highlight this comment 121

When I spoke with Ted Marti, who owns Schell's, last spring, he said that his hope was to get some lighting on the Grain Belt sign to make it more visible at night. Neon wasn't an option because it is cost prohibitive. There were also some other legal issues that were holding it up, if I recall correctly. In regard to relocating it, that won't happen.

Posted on October 30, 2010 at 09:36 AM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 122

I went on the Target Field tour this morning. It was fun!

Got to see the visitor's locker room, got to walk on the field (not on the grass, just on the 'warning track'), got to check out the different clubs and an event suite.

Even found myself in the groundbreaking picture on the Target Field timeline wall. :-)

Posted on October 30, 2010 at 8:33 PM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 123

Nice to see the Ranger's come back and win one at home last night. Did anyone else notice the hot dog stand they showed between innings, with the bacon wrapped dogs? Looked pretty good smothered in onions. Have we heard of any additions or subtractions, in regards to food offerings for next season at Target Field?

Posted on October 31, 2010 at 09:50 AM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 124

F_T_K, how much does it cost for a tour?
Will they shut them down for the year once the snow flies, or do they have a specific date when they won't do anymore this year?

Posted on October 31, 2010 at 1:27 PM by luke Highlight this comment 125

seasons over.. whats next.. time to listen to Luke babble.. hey luke you have get it on with that broad you took to the game?

Posted on October 31, 2010 at 2:17 PM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 126

Luke, the tours are $15. They had about five of them going yesterday at the same time, with five different groups of 10 to 12 people each. I was impressed that they somehow kept the groups from running into each other!

According to the tours page (click the linky!), tours will go through December. Although, I don't think I'd want to be checking out the budweiser roof deck in December... Brrrrr...

The route our group took: Champions club, visitor's locker room, visitor's dugout & field, third base lounge, roof deck, Capt. Morgan space, Legend's club / Carew Lounge, press box, Puckett lounge, 573 Lounge, event suite, and done.

The team had some important stuff going on in the Metropolitan club, so we couldn't go in there.

Just being able to get onto the field was worth the $15 to me. That green grass is soooo lovely. (And so much nicer than that fake stuff at the other place!!!)

Posted on October 31, 2010 at 3:05 PM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 127

lol at maz!!

Posted on November 1, 2010 at 12:06 AM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 128

Selig: Playoff expansion to get 'pragmatic' look

Click Link below

Posted on November 1, 2010 at 11:56 AM by tk Highlight this comment 129

Selig must be stopped....even up to the point of rat poison if necessary!

Posted on November 1, 2010 at 2:34 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 130

Boy, what I wouldn't give to go back to a World Series between the teams who won their respective leagues. I bet the TV ratings would be a lot higher, too...

In Selig-speak, however, that's a post-season with only one round, and only two out of 30 teams participating. Obviously, unacceptable.

Posted on November 1, 2010 at 3:10 PM by Rick 131

Compared to other professional sports leagues, I really like how much importance the MLB puts on the regular season. In leagues like the NBA or NFL, all you have to be is a mediocre team to make the playoffs. I would hate to see the MLB come to that. The only teams that should be in the playoffs, are the ones that earn it during the regular season.

In my opinion, they should look at changing the teams within each division before expanding the number of teams that make the playoffs.

Posted on November 1, 2010 at 4:17 PM by Jeff Highlight this comment 132

Dear Mr Selig,

Don't expand the playoffs. Unless you expand it to 8 teams per league it means additional days off for some teams. Baseball is a sport where the players (and their fans) expect to be played nearly every day. Why disrupt that rhythm just for the sake of including more teams in the postseason? Sorry some teams have to watch from tvs (maybe that will help keep your ratings up).

And while you are pondering things, why don't you ponder going back to a more balanced schedule as maybe that will help clear up the overall playoff picture a bit.

Posted on November 1, 2010 at 4:44 PM by Stevie B Highlight this comment 133

Dear Stevie,

Thank you for taking the time to right, and your concern about major league baseball, and specifically the post-season schedule. I am always interested in the input of the fans, who this game is really meant for.

With that being said, if your ideas don't generate more revenue for the owners, the players, or the league in general as it relates to ticket pricing, endorsement deals, advertising and sponsorship revenue, and of course the financial well-being of everyone except for the fans, we really don't give a shit what you think.

Please feel free to write again in the future!

Your friend,

Bud

Posted on November 1, 2010 at 6:21 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 134

Damn I meant to say write...edit button!

Bud

Posted on November 1, 2010 at 6:22 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 135

Actually, JC... That made it feel even more like (Not My) Bud wrote it.

Posted on November 1, 2010 at 6:45 PM by schweady Highlight this comment 136

Easy TF improvement: Everybody Lean Back campaign. In all of the ballparks I have been to, the main problem has been when fans lean forward in their seats. And I'm 6'1". Some little jingle about leaning back because "here come the Twins" and I would be able to see all of the action.

I have been rooting for the home team in the WS. I feel for the local fans that paid a minimum $125 per ticket. Also, I want 7 games to stretch the summer to the maximum.

Posted on November 1, 2010 at 7:14 PM by Buzz Highlight this comment 137

or time to listen to maz bitch, piss and moan about nothing.
and just for the record maz...what "broad that I took to the game" are you pissin' about?

Posted on November 1, 2010 at 8:11 PM by luke Highlight this comment 138

Congratulations to the Giants. They rather dominated this Series.

Now, bring on Spring Training. ;-)

Posted on November 1, 2010 at 9:59 PM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 139

Nothing against Renteria, but just what does a pitcher have to do to get the MVP? I mean, Lincecum only won half of the games, beat the Rangers' ace twice, and struck out 10 tonight.

It seemed like a no-brainer.

Posted on November 1, 2010 at 10:04 PM by Rick 140

luke...I believe her name was joanie....and word on the street is that you two are expecting....

Posted on November 1, 2010 at 10:26 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 141

Expecting a 20 game package next year?

Posted on November 1, 2010 at 10:43 PM by clublevelfan Highlight this comment 142

I can see why Lincecum didn't get it. He was really good tonight but his last game wasn't great even if he did end up with the W. He was just lucky that Lee was worse that game.

I think I would have chosen Renteria as well.

Nice to see the Giants win though. I was rooting for them after the Twins were out.

Posted on November 1, 2010 at 10:45 PM by AJ Highlight this comment 143

Wow how much did that pitch that Lee hung cost him next year on his contract? 1 yr and 30 mil? Wow 8 day games of sitting in the sun on my 20 game plan C package next year. Gee and I get the Royals 3 times! LOL!

Posted on November 2, 2010 at 09:16 AM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 144

Luke don't play dumb. Everyone clearly remembers Joanie.

Posted on November 2, 2010 at 12:06 PM by Max Highlight this comment 145

Obviously not Max...can't even spell her name right...lol.
As I had said waaaaaaaaay before this post, for all intents and purposes, it's pretty much over between us. Sorry fellas and ladies. Hate to disappoint.

On a lighter note, congrats to the Giants. It's nice to see a team other than the Yankees, or the Red Sox, or the Yankees, or THE Yankees, or the YANKEES, OR the Yankees, or the Yankees, or the Phillies, or the Yankees, or the Yankees (you see where I'm going with this) win the World Series.

Posted on November 2, 2010 at 5:57 PM by luke Highlight this comment 146

Now that Luke is single again, he has time to return to previous pursuits....

Posted on November 2, 2010 at 10:23 PM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 147

I hope we make a deal with Thome. I thoroughly enjoyed watching his giddiness in post game interviews. One, to-be, 41 year old, I would love to have on a Minnesota team!

Posted on November 2, 2010 at 11:57 PM by TK Highlight this comment 148

Thanks a lot Truth....As if incontinence issues don't already plague me enough in my old age.

Posted on November 3, 2010 at 03:25 AM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 149

In case anyone is interested, the Target Field book sold by Amazon is indeed a hard cover. Mine arrived today - very nice looking book.

Posted on November 3, 2010 at 4:59 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 150

Arizona Fall League All-Star game is live on MLB network Saturday (11/6) from Surprize, AZ.

Posted on November 3, 2010 at 5:42 PM by Buzz Highlight this comment 151

@ 8:00 pm.

Posted on November 3, 2010 at 5:44 PM by Buzz Highlight this comment 152

Still the same $40 cover price jfh?

Posted on November 3, 2010 at 6:21 PM by luke Highlight this comment 153

Yes, cover price $40, Amazon was $26 and change.

Posted on November 3, 2010 at 6:57 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 154

The one sold at amazon is a different edition.

Posted on November 3, 2010 at 7:05 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 155

Do you know what makes them different?

Posted on November 3, 2010 at 7:41 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 156

If someone can post the ISBN number of the ballpark edition, we can compare, but my understanding is that it is the same book, except that those copies sold at the ballpark have a sticker on the front dustcover. I would be very surprised if the book itself is any different.

Posted on November 3, 2010 at 8:46 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 157

Rick....Your flagpole in all its glory in the video here...fast forward to 4:15

Posted on November 3, 2010 at 11:34 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 158

ISBN of my 'bought at the ballpark' copy:

978-0-7603-3842-1

Posted on November 4, 2010 at 08:33 AM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 159

Was it just me, or did the Twins only play music after home runs in the exhibition game and in the post season?

Posted on November 4, 2010 at 08:35 AM by twinlves Highlight this comment 160

twinlves,

Now that you mention it, I believe so. Unfortunately, we only saw one HR in the Postseason :(

Posted on November 4, 2010 at 10:19 AM by tk Highlight this comment 161

Two. Hudson and Cuddyer.

Posted on November 4, 2010 at 11:43 AM by AJ Highlight this comment 162

AJ, was only at game #1 and you cannot hear anything like that on TV

Posted on November 4, 2010 at 12:20 PM by tk Highlight this comment 163

Ah, I didn't realize you meant you specifically for some reason. Understood. I was only at game one as well and I don't even remember it then for some reason.

Posted on November 4, 2010 at 1:22 PM by AJ Highlight this comment 164

ISBN of the copy from Amazon: 978-0-7603-3965-7 (both on the dust cover and on the book's copyright page. 224 pages.

The ballpark edition certainly has a different cover (says "Ballpark Commemorative Edition" and the subtitle is between Target and Field on the cover), but I can't find any description of the differences in the actual content of the book itself, so if anyone does know, please share.

Posted on November 4, 2010 at 3:12 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 165

luke,

i take joanie did not take to the mickey you slipped in her beer? there will be another one for you soon,, you just keep telling your dates all the cool stuff you share with us and you will score in no time...

Posted on November 4, 2010 at 9:32 PM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 166

Undercover Boss this weekend is at Wrigley Field, looking forward to the show.

Posted on November 5, 2010 at 12:26 AM by tk Highlight this comment 167

it's been two weeks since the last new post, i thought your official review was coming in the next few days!

Posted on November 5, 2010 at 09:58 AM by jp Highlight this comment 168

Still spelling the name wrong Maz

Posted on November 5, 2010 at 11:30 AM by luke Highlight this comment 169

Get it right Maz!!!!

Posted on November 5, 2010 at 1:23 PM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 170

It was fun watching the replay of the Legends Game on FSN this afternoon. I've been having TF withdrawal for too long. Nice to see the place again.

Posted on November 6, 2010 at 5:51 PM by luke Highlight this comment 171

If anyone gets a chance to watch Undercover Boss tonight, it was a very interesting story to see the behind the scenes work of Wrigley Field. My wife and I want baseball to start again now!

Posted on November 7, 2010 at 11:16 PM by TK Highlight this comment 172

*Gets a chance to watch a recording from tonight's Undercover Boss

Posted on November 7, 2010 at 11:16 PM by TK Highlight this comment 173

The Twins just tweeted....

"Tomorrow we announce some enhancements to Target Field for the 2011 season."

Anyone have any ideas?

Posted on November 9, 2010 at 11:14 AM by Joe117 Highlight this comment 174

Dedicated spots for sharpshooters armed with tasers to take down anyone starting the wave?

Posted on November 9, 2010 at 11:57 AM by jfh Highlight this comment 175

New scoreboard being installed...not sure exactly where

Posted on November 9, 2010 at 12:01 PM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 176

It's going to be installed where the "trap sign" was displayed last season above the grandstand seating area.

I personally don't like the fact they are adding a second video board, but oh well. Those few fans in LF apparently complained too much even though they knew ahead of time they would not be able to see the main videoboard, at least those STH's in left field should have been well aware of the obstruction issue.

It's a BASEBALL-ONLY facility meaning there WILL be some obstructions and not all seats would be able to view the videoboard.

Also, what do you really need to see on the videoboard??? They rarely show any controversial replays. Other than a few replays here and there...JB Hudson Kiss Cam? Blue Bunny text your tune? Best Buy Sing-along with TC? Race to Target Field?

Mistake by the Twins to add a second videoboard...just my opinion.

Posted on November 9, 2010 at 12:18 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 177

so you just prefer the traditional advertising vs a scoreboard that a percentage of fans, "those few fans", may enjoy. thanks for sharing buddy. since when does a baseball only facility preclude multiple video boards? I sit in leftfield a lot and would welcome the twins adding this.

Posted on November 9, 2010 at 12:40 PM by tim Highlight this comment 178

Than don't sit in LF if you so prefer to see the videoboard...

It's your CHOICE where you want to sit. If cost is an issue, there ARE affordable seats with great views of the videoboard...Grandstand seats, Syline View seats, Field View seats....

Also, the LF stands were half empty for a lot of Twins games this year and I am not exagerrating when I say that.

The best ballparks only have one videoboard...

And there is plenty of advertising throughout the ballpark...and "scoreboard" and "videoboard" are two different things if you ask me.

Posted on November 9, 2010 at 12:49 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 179

How are you seriously complaining about a decent stadium upgrade? Ticket prices are set...it's not going to cost you anything.

Posted on November 9, 2010 at 1:17 PM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 180

I am not complaining about the "upgrades" but am rather saying a second videoboard is not needed, especially in the SECOND YEAR of a brand-new ballpark.

It just seems Minnesota fans always find something to complain about at a ballpark/stadium.

Why do they need a second video board??? Does Fenway Park have two videoboards? Wrigley Field? PNC Park? SBC Park? Camden Yards? PETCO Park? Safeco Field?

The point is, and the fact of the matter is that there are going to be obstructions in a baseball-only ballpark...

I am a traditionalist and enjoy the simplicity of ballparks. If I sit in LF, than I expect to not be able to see the main videoboard. If I want to see the videoboard, than I pick seats where I can see the videoboard.

Posted on November 9, 2010 at 2:58 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 181

The upper left field seats seem to be used for a lot of group event seating. A lot of group attendees might not be what you would consider a traditionalist and don't have their choice of seats (outside of the group coordinator and that is limited as well). Their expectations might be different than someone else. I sat up there for one game (in a group) and it was slightly annoying not to be able to see shown replays (the unshown ones are a whole other story), especially on plays that happen outside of your line of view (balls at the fence or in the LF corner). It didn't ruin my enjoyment of the game or anything but would be a nice option to have since the replays on the wall in right center were nearly worthless.

By the way, whose traditions dictate what is and isn't traditional at the ballpark? For someone in their 20s or 30s it might be considered traditional to have multiple video boards, etc at the ballpark. Mind you, I am not a part of that generation but the question bears asking.

Posted on November 9, 2010 at 3:42 PM by Stevie B Highlight this comment 182

Congratulations to Joe Mauer on his 3rd Gold Glove. /cheer

Posted on November 9, 2010 at 3:59 PM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 183

Will people in the lower deck left field even be able to see the new board? The overhang of the upper tier seems to extand almost to the outfield wall. that would make seeing a video board above the trap pretty difficult. Of course, I'vre neveer sat out there, so I'm merely speculating.
But boy, for such a non-issue, we've already got people with smoke pouring out their ears.

Posted on November 9, 2010 at 5:33 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 184

I'm glad the Twins are still looking for ways to improve Target Field.

Now, if they could just improve the fans' post-season experience...

Posted on November 9, 2010 at 5:36 PM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 185

I have tickets in the lf bleachers, and there is no way anybody but the first row or two will be able to see the new video board if it's above the trap. The place it should go is above the metro club, there is a panel that blocks off some ac units which could easily fit a metrodome sized board that would be could be seen by everybody except the top couple rows while not blocking any view of skyline which is my fear with an over the trap board.

Posted on November 9, 2010 at 9:32 PM by jp Highlight this comment 186

Rick: Picked up a real cool new ballpark book at Costco ($15.99) a couple weeks ago. It is a huge coffee table type book. Have you seen this one? It has Target Field and a preview of the new Marlins ballpark. Sorry I don't have the title in front of me...

Posted on November 9, 2010 at 10:58 PM by Max Highlight this comment 187

"They rarely show any controversial replays."

Never is a much more accurate word.

Posted on November 9, 2010 at 11:28 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 188

If they are putting the new scoreboard where the trap sits now, I agree it's a horrible idea. It's way too close to the other scoreboard to really serve any purpose other than making the outfield look cluttered.

I'm not crazy about a second scoreboard anywhere, but if they are going to do it they should do it on top of the Metropolitan Club.

Posted on November 9, 2010 at 11:44 PM by Buffalo Highlight this comment 189

I'm on record long ago as recommending a second video board. This idea was strengthened for me when I went to TCF Bank Stadium and found that they had added one there rather late in the process -- and it's essential.

But I think there are two reasons why they wouldn't consider going on top of the Metropolitan Club. The first is that it may be difficult or impossible from an engineering standpoint to add weight up there.

Remember that the Met Club is cantilevered out from the main structure. It was designed to be free-standing (with nothing underneath) and then the ticket offices had to be placed beneath it (much to the disappointment of the engineers, who worked very hard to figure out how to get it done) since there was nowhere else to put them. Even so, that construction underneath is probably not load-bearing.

That leads right to the second problem. Having already compromised the line of the design by building underneath, I'm sure they don't want to do anything to make it worse. A big scoreboard up there would look great from inside the park (where it counts) but probably not so good from the outside. It would, at least, drastically change the signature image of the ballpark which has been used to build the brand.

I also suggested way back then that a second board could go over Gate 34, but the connection to the city has proven too attractive to disrupt that way. Eventually, I think they will have to reconfigure the outfield seating there anyway, but I'm pretty sure they'll still want to maintain that view out onto the plaza and the city streets. Of course, that could all change if the Sanford sign remains an issue.

That leaves the Trap sign as the next best spot. I think it works just fine, despite the fact that it still won't cover every area of the ballpark.

I've also said that I was pleasantly surprised by just how visible the big board was from places I thought might be obstructed.

What I haven't said yet is that I never warmed up to the appearance of the graphics that they used on these boards. My eyes just never quite could pick out things fast enough, I think because the whites were so bright against the backgrounds and often accompanied by highlighter-yellow letters and high-contrast faux-shadows. And for all the space they have, everything always seemed so scrunched together (especially on the ribbon boards). There is some work to be done on the scoreboard color schemes.

And I came to absolutely hate the placement of the out-of-town scoreboard, but only because it appears behind the pitcher in so many of the TV shots. And it looks like crap because it's behind chain-link fencing.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 12:27 AM by Rick 190

Max,

Can we get an ISBN or UPC?

I've added almost 20 books to my library since I last updated the bibliography, so I may have it. But I've also passed on a few that were just reissues with very little new content. (I'll buy those when they get down into the $1 range in a few months. Yes, I'm cheap.)

One new one is completely awesome: Big League Ballparks: The Complete Illustrated History. Highly recommended.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 12:44 AM by Rick 191

I'm not in favor of another replay board above the trap - too close to existing one. If the fans sitting in the lower level of LF want to see replays, there are flat screen TV's hanging above every section, just look up at the cantilevered rafters above you....there's your replay. If the fans in upper left field really have to see a replay, turn your damn head, that's what your neck is for anyway - use it! The Twins should take the money they're going to spend on an unnecessary replay board and spend it instead on buying necessary players who actually show up in the post season.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 01:28 AM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 192

Click my name for a report from WCCO in regards to the new video board, more radiant heating, the search for new signature food items, and free WiFi at Target Field. They also stated that the new video board will display some different information from the main video board. They don't want people who have a view of both screens to see the exact same content.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 08:21 AM by Jeff Highlight this comment 193

For some reason I recall part of the agreement between The Twins and Hennipen County for funding the stadium was that the Twins invest so much money in upgrading/maintaining the ballpark every year.

Anyone else recall this? I thought it was a set dollar figure but couldn't find it.

I did although find the Executive lease summary between the MBA and the Twins, which states the Twins are to "maintain the Ballpark in a first-class condition". I guess that means we should be expecting more upgrades like this from year to year then.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 09:29 AM by Duffman Highlight this comment 194

and again, this constant complaining reiterates why i now rarely post..

in left field you can only see those TVs for replays in rows 7+. why not be happy the twins are willing to improve aspects of our beloved ballpark.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 09:31 AM by A Former Poster Highlight this comment 195

Those LCD screens were necessary, but really are a pretty poor substitute for access to the big board -- mostly because they are simply too small. They'd need to be roughly twice the size before being comfortable to actually watch.

This goes for most of the LCD screens which are either on the concourses or over seating areas. (The ones in the clubs and suites are just fine.)

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 10:14 AM by Rick 196

You guys reading about this Twins tower?

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 10:17 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 197

Uhh, no. (Can you help us?)

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 10:24 AM by Rick 198

It's in the Star Tribune article about the improvements. They say it is a 100 foot tower that will go next to the new scoreboard and will be made out LEDs?

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 10:26 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 199

There is a mock up of the video board and the tower on the Startrib website. I'm not sure if the video board will be as small as the one shown there though. It looks good though!

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 10:30 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 200

The 100 foot Twins Tower is a cool idea...slight nod Rick to the original flagpole?

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 10:31 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 201

I'm not crazy about the rendering, but I'm in the minority I guess. I just seems like overkill to me and the "tower" is approaching Nationals Park territory in my opinion at least.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 10:38 AM by Buffalo Highlight this comment 202

Wow, that article changed pretty drastically when it refreshed (lousy Strib web site)!

Great image. Great idea. Nicely done.


And actually, that tower is something of a nod to the need for more verticality in the design, even perhaps another signature design element since the Celebration Sign was ultimately a bit underwhelming. I like it!

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 10:44 AM by Rick 203

Using the out of town scoreboard as scale (110 feet wide) you would think that the actual scoreboard will be a little bit bigger than the rendering (they said it is 50 feet wide). It looks a lot more integrated than I expected. I think it is a much better use of the Trap area.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 10:49 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 204

That 'tower' looks like it's trying to be a nod to the new Guthrie Theater with its giant ugly eyesore tower.

I like the video board. The tower, not so much.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 10:51 AM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 205

Oh, and loving the free wi-fi idea. Being able quickly check email, or send a picture, or (horrors!) do some actual "work" while at the ballpark will be nice.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 10:53 AM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 206

Yes, my Droid 2 will love the free wifi because getting 3G service in most areas of the park was a nightmare...

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 10:57 AM by Rick 207

I like it, it should be visible for most of us in the lf bleachers too, only those at the very top will be missing out, and they've got the lcds to check out.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 11:00 AM by jp Highlight this comment 208

Im ready for opening day. Last year I bought tickets off Stubhub for far too much, but then was able to get some more the week of the opener. Hope to get some tickets from the Twins directly this year. My season ticket package has Game 2 in it.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 11:01 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 209

The Twins Twitter page has some more renderings. They also said that the new board will be 3 times the size of the one at the Dome.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 11:07 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 210

Now that the twins have another signature celebration piece (LED tower) they need to figure out a more intimidating Home Run song/sequence. Listen to the Yankees sequence when they hit a HR. Sounds like the siren from a horror movie (which has been the case for the Twins) but still I shudder when I hear that cursed noise.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 11:55 AM by MattW Highlight this comment 211

I always felt that the Met pole should be kept at it's original height and pestered Hoy about it more than once. Of course, it's only for displaying the flag of our nation, apparently a secondary (at best) consideration.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 11:58 AM by Ben Highlight this comment 212

Yeah, i'm iffy on the Twins Tower. I mean, what's the point?

It might become an eyesore to batters and a condominium for kestrels.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 12:30 PM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 213

It's fair to compare the new trap tower to those on the Guthrie.

But I've always thought of those Guthrie towers as a gimmick, and not well suited to the building to which they are attached. For all practical purposes, they are impossible to read from a distance, and they have a garish quality which runs counter to the rest of the building. (They do add verticality -- their only positive attribute.)

They're intended to evoke the smokestacks which cluttered the area 100 years ago, of course, but they don't succeed at that very well. They look like arbitrary appendages, not particularly in balance with the rest of the shapes which make up the complex. Actual smokestacks have a heft and gruff, utilitarian character which is tough to emulate.

Like so much of that building, the towers simply call attention to the fact that it was designed by someone famous. The design of the new Guthrie has always seemed to me to be overwhelmed by the architect's ego.

This new TF tower, on the other hand, makes perfect sense in this type of building. There's nothing fancy going on, it fits in nicely, is well-proportioned, makes good use of otherwise underutilized space, connects to the shapes which appear beyond it, and is actually useful.

My only wish is that it were actually taller. There may have been constraints placed by the city or historical district or some other entity on the overall height.

And, for those who care, if that tower is indeed 100 feet tall, that's the original height of the flagpole when it was back at Met Stadium. It had been shortened a bit when moved to the Richfield American Legion (to about 90 feet above ground), and the Twins cut that height roughly in half for installation at TF.

The other half is stored in the basement of the ballpark somewhere.

Restoring it to its original height would be great, but there may be weight restrictions because I think it sits on the bridge over the 394 entrance ramp.

Also, there would be more work to restoring that height than just putting the two halves together. A two to three-foot section was cut out of the middle for metallurgical testing and souvenirs (of which I have one). That would have to be replicated and reinserted.

Probably not a big deal, but I think it's not very likely to happen, which is too bad.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 12:35 PM by Rick 214

Here are a couple of useful images:


Pillsbury "A" Mill, circa 1900:



Posted on November 10, 2010 at 12:55 PM by Rick 215

i see the twins are buying off the gimmic-loving rube fans once again.

get ready for them to NOT go after any legit free agents this offseason, but rather settle on selling the hell out of the fact that they added an unnecessary second scoreboard (i.e. electronic advertising board), an unnecessary electronic tower, some more unnecessary concourse heating (that will be used for 2 weeks of the entire season), and some more underwhelming minnesota themed food items. and the gimmic-loving, rubish fans out there will for some reason love them for it.

meanwhile your favorite, underperforming club will not win a world series or a playoff series yet again.......but hey at least we can access wi-fi.....or as the twins shamelessly are calling it "twi-fi".

these are the most useless, unnecessary enhancements. invest this money in a free agent signing or signings......not a bunch of foo-foo gimmic crap around the ballpark.

two thumbs down......only because it is junk that is completely unnecessary and has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH THE UNDERWHELMING PRODUCT ON THE FIELD OR WITH WINNING A PLAYOFF SERIES/WORLD SERIES.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 1:07 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 216

I don't have the exact numbers yet, but I think the amount of money they're spending wouldn't even buy Nick Punto for next year.

The reason they're not winning playoff series has -- literally -- nothing to do with ballpark enhancements, and everything to do with the overall economics of the sport.

If you want to take out your wrath on someone, take it out on Bud Selig and the union -- and quickly before they water down the playoffs even further.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 1:22 PM by Rick 217

One more thing: Ballpark enhancements may buy off "gimmic-loving rube fans", but they may also lead those same fans to drop a few more bucks at the ol' ballpark. Thus, ballpark enhancements lead directly to the possibility that the team will get better.

Whether it does or not is up to Jim and Bill and Gardy. A little encouragement from the fans always helps, of course.

But making the ballpark better isn't the enemy here.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 1:30 PM by Rick 218

kudos to the twins design-team! they knock one out of the park for these upgrades. next year? mechanical minnie/paul hands instead of lights.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 1:58 PM by yeahklye Highlight this comment 219

For those who insist that a second board is not necessary, the whole left field corner in the lower deck is for sure cut out from seeing the main scoreboard. You should not have to choose a seat based on getting information about the game. This is a good and right decision to make.

The trap is a fine location for it, too. Having seen here suggestions about the roof of the Met Club, I'm glad that was not the choice. A board up there would have destroyed one of the elegant lines of the ballpark.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 3:00 PM by fiesta Highlight this comment 220

"You should not have to choose a seat based on getting information about the game."

Best way to get information about the game is to watch it.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 3:28 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 221

agree with Beta 100%. gimmicky crap. the tower is cheesy, and is discouraging because I did not expect them to add this nonsense to an otherwise beautiful park so early in it's existence. Think the milk jug at the dome or the Wild's new mascot for other examples. Rick these "upgrades" don't always help - if you don't think that this kind of attempt to carnival up a sports facility hasn't hurt revenue before, you didn't visit Michigan stadium during the "halo"'s 3 year appearance ending in 2000 (click link)

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 3:32 PM by mplsgreg Highlight this comment 222

A) I like the video board idea. The Trap sign looked too weird. I like the way it is in the renderings of the new video board.
Thumbs up to the Twins Tower idea as well. That ought to brighten things up real nice on an otherwise poorly-lit alley (aka Target Plaza).

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 3:35 PM by luke Highlight this comment 223

Some of you are such glass is half empty people. The Twins have made the playoffs 6 of the last 10 years. That is a pretty incredible run. I realize that they have not made it to a World Series, and the reasons why can be debated. As a baseball fan, if my team is playing meaningful games in September, I consider that season a pretty fun one to be a fan.

I think the new upgrades at the park are great. I buy 5 games in the first row in LF and these seats are great, except for the lack of a scoreboard. Yes, I knew I wouldn't be able to see it and I was fine with that, but if I can see a videoboard now, well, even better. If the Twins put a tower in the field of play, then I might have a problem with it, but it will not play a major part in your fan viewing experience, right?

Call me a rube, but some of you just don't get how fortunate you are to have a solid team to cheer for and watch. And now we have one of the best stadiums to watch them in - BONUS!

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 3:46 PM by ole Highlight this comment 224

Ole-

I think the reason people, me included, are frustrated in the team is they never seem to take that next step. They rest on their laurels of making the play-offs and tout that as a sucess. It is a loser's mindset. Look at the Yankees, everyone in that organization know the is only one goal, winning the World Seires, and if they do not achive that goal the season is a failure.

Some people say winning isn't everything, and that is fine in little league or babe ruth, but this is professional baseball, they are not getting paid to go out and lose, well maybe the Royals are. We as a fan base need to stop making excuses for our team and our players.

On a different note has any season ticket holders received their relocation/upgrade info? The process was to be started on the 1st and I haven't seen or heard anything.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 4:02 PM by Duffman Highlight this comment 225

Duffman, you need to mention also that the Yankees are able to compete for and get the best players that free agency has to offer year after year. The have the luxury of adding players during the season, regardless of what it might cost them in dollars or prospects. They are also able to retain the best players regardless of the salary the player may demand.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 4:22 PM by Jeff Highlight this comment 226

What we all want to know is: What does luke think about all the improvements?

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 4:24 PM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 227

TTH, see comment 223.

And, for the record, the only goal which matters to any big business like a Major League baseball team is profitability. Winning, whether in the regular or postseason, is just one means to an end.

As such, there are certainly degrees of success for any given season. Even for the Pirates, believe it or not.

(Not excusing anything, of course, but just wanting to maintain some sense of the reality.)

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 4:32 PM by Rick 228

I don't mind the extra video board (I constantly look at the main scoreboard-I like stats), but the Tower looks awful in the picture renderings. Hopefully it will look better in person....

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 4:58 PM by AJ Highlight this comment 229

Well, I'm glad they are only putting up one, otherwise we'd have Twin Towers -- and that would be a p.r. nightmare, especially if Kirby the Kestrel intentionally flew into them.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 5:12 PM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 230

Now, if they would just go around and level every cup holder in the place...

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 5:21 PM by schweady Highlight this comment 231

Even the NHL is taking digs at Bud.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 7:09 PM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 232

Rick: sorry the book is at my condo in FL. I'll make sure to take a look when I am there in December.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 7:55 PM by Max Highlight this comment 233

Duffman, this team increased its payroll from $65 million to more than $100 million last year. If that isn't "taking the next" step or trying to win, I don't know what is. Did I want Cliff Lee? Yeah, but we didn't get him. You can bitch about it all you want, but you have to root your expectations in reality. Nothing more to it than that.

Posted on November 10, 2010 at 9:43 PM by Buffalo Highlight this comment 234

Awwww Twi-fi....isn't that soooo cuuuuute. Sign me up for season tickets right now!!!

Posted on November 11, 2010 at 07:20 AM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 235

Nothing new here, but if interested, click my name for the fact sheet for the new scoreboard and tower.

Posted on November 11, 2010 at 08:54 AM by Jeff Highlight this comment 236

Schweady I'm pretty sure that they make the cupholders tilted on purpose. That way you either have to suck down your drink or spill a little...the result is more concessions sold.

Posted on November 11, 2010 at 10:42 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 237

Have you guys talked about the Army-ND game at Yankee Stadium coming up on 11/20? I see they striped the field and the infield dirt is gone?!? I can't find any where that says if it's just convered or if they actually put down grass...

Anyone else heard about this?

click my name for a few pics.

Posted on November 11, 2010 at 3:50 PM by CSG Mike Highlight this comment 238

I think the "Twins Tower" will fit in nicely when viewed from the third base line. My thinking is that it will look good against the backdrop of the downtown skyline. The ballpark is too horizontal to have such a vertical backdrop...this should fix that problem.

On another note, if you click on the Playoff Challenge button up top you will notice that I won! Hehe! Of course that means the Twins didn't win, which is, well, expected. But ya, props to me for picking the Giants to win the whole thing!

(Ok, my ego moment is over now)

Posted on November 11, 2010 at 4:22 PM by Andrew Highlight this comment 239

43-42..I didn't know it was that close..Congrats..

Posted on November 11, 2010 at 4:50 PM by Steve Highlight this comment 240

Well, this'll make TTH feel real good...

I think I'm going to rescind my like of the new video board. Someone else around here made the comment that if you want multiple video boards, go to a football stadium.

The multiple video board thing works in arenas and stadiums. While I think the Twins Tower will be a nice touch overall, the video board might be too much.

And seriously, how many ballparks in the league today have dual video boards? Even the SkyDome in Toronto just has the one huge one in center field, and that's a multi-purpose stadium. Fenway, Miller, Comerica, Turner, the list goes on, get by just fine with one video board.

Just for you TTH.

Posted on November 11, 2010 at 5:27 PM by luke Highlight this comment 241

Congratulations, Andrew.

Although I think it's somewhat funny that the top two points getters got almost all their points from the National League results...

;-)

Posted on November 11, 2010 at 6:04 PM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 242

There was still too much parking ramp out there in right field. Anything to cover it up is good. The wind veil is great, but it is best in the daytime and looking south to north. At night the lights from the parking ramp really wash it out. Over time, they'll fix that.

I hops on Target Field Plaza reached the top of the "planters" this fall (there is a fancy word for it -- topieries?). Those will be great next year. In any case, I love TF but don't feel it is the greatest sporting venue in world. However, if the Twins are willing to throw $3-5M a year at it, and bring in new food on a regular basis, well they have a season ticket for life from me, and TF will really deserve to be in the top 5. Kudos!

Posted on November 11, 2010 at 9:29 PM by Lincster Highlight this comment 243

For those of you interested in relocation of your seats, I recieved this today.

Thank you for registering your interest in relocating your Twins season tickets for the 2011 season. Your chance to relocate your season tickets is about to begin and we wanted to keep you up to date on the timing for the relocation process.

Around December 1st, you will be sent an email detailing information about the online relocation process, appointment date & times, site navigation and general season ticket holder instructions. As a reminder, the entire relocation process will be handled online starting December 7th. If, for whatever reason, you will be unavailable during your assigned appointment time or need special assistance, please contact us as soon as possible.

We have worked hard to ensure that this online relocation process is easy to use and fair as possible for Twins Season Ticket Holders interested in relocating their seats. Please note, due to the large volume of renewing season account holders, seating availability for relocation will be limited. If you have any questions or have special needs regarding your relocation request, please call your Twins Ticket Sales and Service Rep directly or the Season Ticket Holder Phone Line at 612-370-4575.

Posted on November 12, 2010 at 10:15 AM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 244

On occasion, members of this site have talked of compiling a section-by-section, row-by-row, seat-by-seat map of TF. Would this online seat selection process afford an opportunity for some STHs with nimble screen hot/print screen keystroke abilities to help compile this large index?

Not saying that's how you want to spend your relocation process, just saying there might be some images of interest not generally available online that would contribute to the knowledge base here.

Posted on November 12, 2010 at 11:41 AM by schweady Highlight this comment 245

Schweady I'd guess it will be the same virtual seat viewer that was available in the past. It had three row ranges I think, and I believe is still available indirectly if you find the URL or Google search for it. See link.

I would love to see a user-driven Wiki where we could enter data without the need to bug Rick. Post photos and comments.

Posted on November 12, 2010 at 11:58 AM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 246

Morneau and other players upset about the Twins not moving the fences in for 2011....give me a break!

Opponents sure didn't seem to have problems hitting home runs. Also, you can't make a knee jerk reaction after just one season (or in Morneau's case, three months).

I will admit the left-center area seems to be too deep at times, but its nice to have a "pitchers park" and see some doubles and triples as well. The right-center area is also troubling at times where the out-of-town videoboard extends out.

Were there balls hit that should have been home runs? Of course. But its outdoor baseball and wind/weather patterns are going to affect the game. It's a fact.

How about waiting a few years before determining if any changes should be considered.

Posted on November 12, 2010 at 12:47 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 247

Couldn't agree more, Mike. Opponents hit a numerical majority of the total home runs at TF this year. With the pitch-to-contact staff that this organization seems to value (or, that this organization is willing to pay for, whichever you prefer), why play into the opponents hands by moving the fences in?

Posted on November 12, 2010 at 1:03 PM by Expectorate Highlight this comment 248

Agreed, Toronto didn't seem to have any trouble finding the seats when they were here. I think he's right the home team was adjusting and psyching themselves out, which is a bad thing.

Posted on November 12, 2010 at 1:33 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 249

I like the idea of a bigger park too. Not sure why Morneau is bitter - the Twins went 53-28 at home this year. If they would have been .500 or lower, then I could see a reason to complain. If our home field plays bigger, than that obviuosly helps our pitchers and the Twins should focus more on hitting doubles and triples in those gaps in left and right center.

Posted on November 12, 2010 at 2:49 PM by ole Highlight this comment 250

I thought Morneau was on the bench in late September when the Blue Jays hit five dingers a game in that series. Evidently not.

Sorry Justin, but when you miss extensive parts of consecutive seasons because of injury, you aren't in a position to complain about the distance to the fences.

K

Posted on November 12, 2010 at 5:19 PM by Kramer Highlight this comment 251

Deeper outfields won't help him out during a salary drive. My goodness, these guys have future contracts to worry about, and weak stats won't cut it.

Posted on November 12, 2010 at 6:27 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 252

Morneau's comments are further proof that this team is a whole is mentally fragile. If it's not the big band yankees that's stopping them, it's there ballpark that is too hard to hit in. Bring back a.j and let him toughen up this clubhouse.

Posted on November 12, 2010 at 7:10 PM by jp Highlight this comment 253

morneau & mauer = whiney little bitches, not the M&M boys.

btw - how is that soft little noggin' of yours morneau? still acting like a baby about that too? me wants the fences moved in too. what a dolt!

Posted on November 12, 2010 at 7:26 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 254

by the way i can't form a sentence, as a whole not is a whole and big bad not big band yankees. big band yankees would be awesome though.

Posted on November 12, 2010 at 7:37 PM by jp Highlight this comment 255

How many concussions have you had, beta? Morneau's had more than one, and there is evidence of an accumulation of damage from repeated concussions.

Posted on November 12, 2010 at 9:17 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 256

Based on the responses here and another forum, Morneau's comments weren't very good for PR. No one is buying into it. Ouch.

Posted on November 12, 2010 at 10:49 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 257

had a couple growing up while playing high-level hockey. was back playing again at full speed in 1-2 weeks max.......not 9 months of b.s. excuses.

Posted on November 13, 2010 at 04:04 AM by Betaband Highlight this comment 258

Everyone's concusssion experiences are diffeerent. Perhaps Morneau's had many more than your two. Perhaps with his previous concussions, he really had his bell rung bad. Perhaps...
Oh, forget it.

Posted on November 13, 2010 at 07:27 AM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 259

Perhaps Morneau has had one too many and should just hang it up if playing in TF is just too hard.

Posted on November 13, 2010 at 07:51 AM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 260

I'd like to hear Bert Blyleven's reply to Justin. I can imagine it would be something like "Move the fences? Definitely! Move 'em out to 500 feet!"

Posted on November 13, 2010 at 08:38 AM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 261

Mournou is a prick and a baby... hes not a gamer.. or a grinder.. move in the fences? thats not gonna healp you from being on the DL to end the season every year or slump the end of the season... take a lesson from pauly on the southside.. get hit in the face with a fastball and comeback and hit a homerun on the next at bat...

i love the improvments, the tower is off the hook.. it give it some feeling... not just brand new stale...im in the left field bleechers and like the idea of the video board.. it cant hurt...if you wanna bitch , bitch about the team not the park

Posted on November 13, 2010 at 11:08 AM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 262

"Mournou"

???????????????????

Posted on November 13, 2010 at 12:13 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 263

Are you basing your "prick and baby" comment on personal experience with the guy, or is this just more hot gas?

Posted on November 13, 2010 at 12:15 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 264

Spelling's never been his strong suit.

Posted on November 13, 2010 at 12:16 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 265

I agree that it's too soon to start moving fences, but I also think that TF didn't come out as "fair" as the team's stated goals. That could be a problem for Bill Smith (assuming it wasn't intentional).

As for Morneau, the days of "man up" as a treatment for concussion are over. Medical science now knows that concussion equals brain damage and is way more serious, with way longer lasting effects, than anybody ever realized.

Call Morneau a pussy if you want, but not because he's taking longer than you'd like to recover from this particular injury.

Posted on November 13, 2010 at 1:59 PM by Rick 266

It's interesting how fans of different sports think about concussions. Football still is very much a "shake it off, you wuss" mentality, while hockey has become very understanding. I guess baseball is somewhere in the middle.

Posted on November 13, 2010 at 2:56 PM by Dodgeboy Highlight this comment 267

yes personal experience.... and dont come to a baseball blog for grammer and spelling lessons, i wonder why none of the original folks are posting on here anymore? umm i wonder...

Posted on November 13, 2010 at 4:15 PM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 268

Dodgeboy-
I think football is starting to get tougher on concussions now too. There seems to be more fines and now a few more rules. And I think there was a recent study that said NFL players are sitting out longer from concussions than they used to.

A lot of current players have been making a big deal about it for the past few years too. They see what concussions have done to those who are now retired and they don't want that to happen to them.

Posted on November 13, 2010 at 6:35 PM by AJ Highlight this comment 269

I saw the saddest thing yesterday. I was gonna take the LRT down to MOA to do some shopping. I was walking on Target Plaza just for the fun of it, here's what I saw: no people, scoreboard wasn't on, neither were the lights, some green tarp was placed over the seats, Gates 34, 14, 6, 29 and 3 were all closed and had padlocks on them, ticket kiosks and will call windows were closed up, no PA guy welcoming people, no "bing" of the ticket scanners, nothing. Saddest thing ever.
And looking outside today, I REALLY want baseball season back.

Posted on November 13, 2010 at 9:49 PM by luke Highlight this comment 270

Touchy, touchy. Who asked for lessons? I simply stated , in response to another post, that you're not the world's greatest speller.

And you really haven't explained how you know, from personal experience, that Morneau is a prick and a baby. When you make a statement like that, you need to explain yourself. I realize that you, like the rest of us, take pleasure in your Internet anonymity, but it doesn't give you leave to make a statement like that without sharing how your personal experience with the man brought you to such a conclusion.

Posted on November 13, 2010 at 10:30 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 271

In your simplified ballpark time line, Kauffman field bears singling out. Kauffman to me was way ahead of it's time and really the first Renaissance Era stadium.

Overall, Target Field is a great ballpark. I'm not sure I would rank it as best stadium currently. I attended about 12 games at Target Field this year and have been to all but two, (Tropicana & Angel's), American league stadiums. Along with a couple of National league stadiums (Giants & Cubs) and some older fields no longer in use.

I'd put TF in the top 5, mostly due to being new and housing the home team! Areas I feel they could improve upon:

1) Congested concourses. The design of having concessions on both sides of concourses along with being open makes for a very narrow lane of through traffic. They need to get rid of all those concessions on the field side of the concourse. And keep walking vendors from setting up shop at the top of the stairwells on the main concourse.
2) Free fan movement. This is probably one of the main reasons the concourses become so congested. With all the standing room only tickets and fans just leaving their seats to stand in better places many areas become over crowded. They need to better restrict fan movement based on tickets held, many stadiums do this.
3) No roof, they can't change this now, but mark my words, soon as the "newness" wears off or the team tanks, weather will impact attendance. Few extra heaters is not going to help.
4) Price. The cost of attending a game has gone through the roof compared to the dome. Especially if you purchase tickets second hand like through stub hub. This may self correct itself once average attendance per game drops to the 15k per game level. Even then, if you want decent tickets, feed the family, and get some trinkets your easily in the $150-$200 range for a family of four. For only around 3 hours of entertainment.
5) Restricted view seats. From overhangs, railings, standing fans, etc. I realize ever seat can't be perfect, but you would think after building this many stadiums designers could get these simple things perfected.

Posted on November 14, 2010 at 3:42 PM by Dave Highlight this comment 272

Dave,

Your #3 - No roof is the biggest reason why TF is in many people's top 5. Baseball belongs outdoors in MN. MN isn't Seattle where it can rain every other day in the summer. MN isn't Phoenix where it's 110 everyday in August. MN isn't Miami or Houston where it's hot, muggy and rainy all summer. How many rainouts did TF have last year? Look at the 20 years the Twins played outdoors, how many rainouts? Not enough to justify a roof. The only reason the Twins played under a roof for 28 years is because the Vikings wanted one, NOT THE TWINS!

Posted on November 14, 2010 at 4:05 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 273

I'll second that motion Kev. People around here loved it when it was raining. Of course, DeVito says that there's only so much you can play on wet grass, cause it'll rip it right up. But the Twins did just fine.

And the one total rainout they had, May 7 against the Orioles, really should never have been called in the first place, cause it cleared up real nice and good by the 7:10 first pitch.

We wanted a ballpark, not a gymnasium, hence no roof (and no second video board).

Posted on November 14, 2010 at 5:22 PM by luke Highlight this comment 274

Even though my seats are nice I signed up for the relocation process..Even if I could move up a few rows..Anyone else get their email about how the process works? looks like it will be exactly the same as when I chose my seats with a time and date linked to my seniority date..Anyone?

Posted on November 14, 2010 at 6:11 PM by Steve Highlight this comment 275

Anyone know if our favorite grounds crew got the tarp down on the field before our 'little' snowstorm this weekend?

Posted on November 14, 2010 at 6:33 PM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 276

I attended numerous games last year and really the only time the concourses were a little too busy was before the game started or an inning in. Then everyone had purchased their food and drink and things had settled down. The idea of doing 'wrap' lines like at the airport might be worth looking into, however.

As for ticket prices, yes they are up, but I'm always amazed at how people whine about prices. Here's an idea: eat before the game, buy affordable tickets or attend "low-demand" nights, and don't buy trinkets. There is also plenty of free parking within a five minute walk.

As for the Twins themselves, the team does not have a leader and until they get one this team just doesn't have it come the playoffs. Mauer and Morneau are both very good players, but they are not leaders.

A-Rod, Jeter, Rivera - very good players and leaders. The Twins have a void here.

Has free agency started yet or are things incredibly quiet so far?

K

Posted on November 14, 2010 at 7:18 PM by Kramer Highlight this comment 277

I don't know if there's "plenty" of free parking around TF. If there is, I'd sure be interested to know where that is. I park in a lot about six blocks from TF and they charge $5 per game, which is pretty decent if you ask me.

If nothing else, plop down $1.75-$2.25 (depending on rush hour) for a light rail or bus trip to the place.

But I'd sure like to know where this ample free parking is...and if such a thing does exist, it probably fills up rather quickly.

Posted on November 14, 2010 at 9:22 PM by luke Highlight this comment 278

They need to better restrict fan movement based on tickets held, many stadiums do this

Maybe, but don't see how that's possible at TF, where everyone (except Champion's Club patrons) enters the stadium on the 'open-all-the-way-around' main concourse, and all other levels are ultimately accessed from that concourse. Whether your destination is upper deck, LC, lower deck, trap, home run porch, etc., you have no choice but to spend at least some time on the main concourse.

Seems to me the only way around this is to follow the example of the stadium you mentioned - Kauffman. If memory serves, they have dedicated upper concourse gates, which lead to escalators that take you from ground level just outside the stadium, right up to the upper concourse, completely bypassing the lower level.

Perhaps this is possible at TF's site, but I imagine the space restrictions had something to do with how it ended up.

Free parking? Go West, young luke, go West.

Posted on November 14, 2010 at 10:10 PM by Expectorate Highlight this comment 279

Not sure how I missed this (from Wikipedia's "Miami Ballpark")...

Aquatic Home Plate Backstop: The Marlins announced that dual aquariums that will serve as a home-plate backstop. The aquariums have been designed and will be built in Florida by Living Color Enterprises Inc, the world's leading custom aquarium manufacturer. They will be built on each side of home plate and will be been positioned to prevent any disruption to players on the field. The aquarium to the right of home plate (when looking from the pitcher's mound) measures an impressive 34 feet (10 m) long, 36 inches (91 cm) high and holds over 600 US gallons (2,300 l) of seawater, while the aquarium to the left, will be 24 feet (7.3 m) in length, holding 450 US gallons (1,700 l) of water. Each aquarium will be constructed using a durable fiberglass structure; while crystal-clear acrylic panels 1.5 inches (3.8 cm) thick will be used for the impressive viewing windows that run the entire length of the aquariums. To safeguard the exhibits from impacts, Lexan will be installed in front and in back of the acrylic panels to protect the aquarium from foul balls, errant pitches or any other unexpected contact.,[19]
The People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (PETA) have objected to the proposed Aquarium idea and has suggested either a mural or televisions which would display pictures of deep water fish. Marlins Owner Jeffrey Loria has declined this suggestion. (June 15, 2010; local news)

Posted on November 14, 2010 at 10:14 PM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 280

As a kid, we were alwways told not to tap the glass on fish tanks because doing so could give the fish heart attacks. Passed balls and front row fans accidentally or intentionally kicking the aquariums may result in a lot of fish floating on the surface during games. It could get ugly.

Posted on November 14, 2010 at 10:33 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 281

Last year I parked along 5th street north no meters. Tough for day games to finda a spot. Then there are always the somali lots underneath the bridges next door. Lets hope they do not slap meters up there next year! Of course always stop in the Holiday station right there and pick up my dogs and peanuts!

Posted on November 15, 2010 at 11:47 AM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 282

They can just have a fresh seafood concession stand that specializes in serving the dead aquarium fish. It can be exclusively for their Champion Club members, kind of like a lobster tank. Hungry fans in the section will cheer when a fish croaks, and PETA will be happy that nothing goes to waste.

Posted on November 15, 2010 at 12:01 PM by Kingduck Highlight this comment 283

Oh the good old roof debate that will never end...

Yes, when the TF honeymoon ends, the weather will play a significant factor in attendance, but the fact of the matter is, attendance will always be lower pre-Memorial Day and post-Labor Day with a few exceptions such as Opening Day and premium opponents. Games in April and September are not always the most popular games, not to mention, when the opponents seem to be teams like Kansas City and Cleveland.

Every team faces these issues...

Roof or no roof, attendance always drops off after Labor Day. And the Twins (and other teams) have variable pricing plans in place for those April/May/September games. There is a reason why a majority of games from Memorial Day thru Labor Day are "premium" games.

And it makes no sense to sit here and compare TF prices to Metrodome prices...you need to compare apples to apples such as teams in other similar markets such as Seattle, Cleveland, Colorado.

I signed up for the seat relocation process as well but am not expecting much of an "upgrade" as most STH's are going to stay status quo or upgrade from 20 to 40 or 40 to full-season. I have been told numerous times that my best bet will be to stay status quo.

I just figured it was worth a try to move up a few rows or move to a different section in the same pricing tier.

Posted on November 15, 2010 at 12:31 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 284

Regarding the seat relocation process - it is my understanding that they are going to use the same system as was used for moving from the Dome to TF, though I think I heard that the exclusive window for each person would be smaller.

As for comparing ticket prices between Coors Field and Target Field - comparing apples to applies - Coors Field Infield Box STH price is $35, TF Home Plate Box is $53 or 51% more. The gap for box office prices is narrower and some games are higher (e.g. Coors Field opening day is $110).

Posted on November 15, 2010 at 12:46 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 285

I hate it when people complain about the costs of attending a game at Target Field. Sure, it can be expensive, if you let it be. But finding tickets off StubHub, parking in the free areas and buying your food ahead of time are all good ways to save money. I don't think I ever spent more than $50 at a ball game (including tickets) this year, and that was on the high end for two people (usually it was just me and my oldest daughter or my dad going to a game).

We went one night last minute, got tickets off StubHub in the Legends Club for $15 total and parked on the west side of the ballpark for free. I dropped another $20 on food once inside, so for $35 we had a great time. And that was one of the more expensive outings to the park this season.

Posted on November 15, 2010 at 4:37 PM by Buffalo Highlight this comment 286

Buffalo - I'm not really sure how getting LC seats at about 15% of cost is relevant to costs of attending a game at TF.

I suspect most families plan an outing to the park in advance, rather than to look for last minute bargain basement pricing on SH. No matter how you look at it, it is significantly more expensive for the average family/fan to go see a game at TF than it was at the Dome. There are many reasons for it, but it's a issue for many if the family income hasn't gone up 30%-40% in two years.

For the market size, TF cost seems to be above average and that will continue as long as demand is there. There are always ways to see a game at any park for a fraction of "box office" prices, but just because it can be done doesn't mean it's reasonable to expect everyone to be able to do it whenever they want to see a game.

Posted on November 15, 2010 at 5:26 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 287

I believe the cost of attending a game at TF, especially for a family, is a significant issue. The Twins are shutting out many of the very people they relied upon to build them their new palace.

Posted on November 15, 2010 at 5:59 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 288

Supply and demand. If you go next door, The Sanford place, you can practically get in for the cost of sending an e-mail.

Posted on November 15, 2010 at 6:55 PM by TK Highlight this comment 289

I don't know Ben. I think the Twins will still be one of the greatest deals in all of MLB. Sure, the prices went up a bit...but good grief, you wanna take a fam of four, sit in the Family Section. You get free hot dogs and pop too.
At least we're not charging $2400 to sit behind home plate like the Yankees are in their palace. I hope it doesn't happen here, but second-year attendance at new ballparks is lower for whatever reason. Just ask the Brewers, or the Mets.
And TK has it right. I remember when there were like seven or eight price categories in the Upper Level at the Sanford place back in the Wolves' heydey, now they're practically giving away season tickets, and they went from several price levels in the Upper Level to two.

Posted on November 15, 2010 at 9:11 PM by luke Highlight this comment 290

A bit of news for you, Luke - please read carefully: Nothing is free.

Posted on November 15, 2010 at 11:08 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 291

Wow, what a gimmick-filled monstrosity they're building in Miami. One word..YUCK! It's sad in some markets they just can't seem to make their ballparks about the game of baseball. This one is about fish tanks, swimming pools. I guess this is what's needed in markets where baseball takes a back seat to stupid crap at a ballpark. Amusement parks are for rides, ballparks are for baseball. Thank GOD we didn't do this in Minnesota. Thank you again Mike Opat for saying, this is what we're going to do and we're not going to fund anything else...No roof, no bullshit. It's baseball dammit! BASEBALL!

Posted on November 15, 2010 at 11:29 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 292

If the kiddies want to go on rides....After the game is over, hop on the train and take them down to camp sniper...TF will prove by the test of time to be a wonderful ballpark much like Royals Stadium did in KC. Although I see KC has added some rinky-dink stuff in their remodel, however, baseball hasn't been very good in KC the past 15 years.

Posted on November 15, 2010 at 11:34 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 293

From The Star:

boldPostseason could changebold

italicGMs to discuss adding extra wild-card teams.italic

Click Link

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 02:13 AM by tk Highlight this comment 294

Cannot say I am tech savy...

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 02:14 AM by tk Highlight this comment 295

You're right, Kev. The world has remained static all these centuries and now all the sudden things are changing. What gives?

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 05:48 AM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 296

Yeah...prices are too high! Bring back Twins baseball 2000! I could sit in the upper deck of the dome over right field, not see the sky or the right fielder, all for $4! I could get in any game I wanted to, as we drew 1,000,760 for the season. We played 38 games to crowds under 10,000. July 4 against the Red Sox drew 9,209. At least that day I didn't have to complain about inadequate fireworks.

Well, we didn't have rail, so I had to pay for parking. Or park way on the west bank and walk. If I paid my $4, there were still 4 red coat folks making sure I stayed in my assigned section. Oh, and I still had to pay $5 for a dome dog. And $4 for a soda. And those were pretty much my food choices outside of nachos. And our payroll was $24M total. And we finished 69-93, 26 games behind, for our 8th consecutive sub-.500 season. But it was cheap damnit, and I could go to a game whenever I wanted!

Ah, the good old days....

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 08:12 AM by Lincster Highlight this comment 297

TF has its own issues with right field blind spots, not as bad as the dome, but their still there.

A family of four taking the rail will probably cost more than parking. A 6 hour event pass on the light rail is $4 per person, parking in the A/B/C ramps is $13.

The dome had some decent food choices other than just dogs, soda, and nachos. The Carvery, which was one of the highest rated food choices at the dome made its way over to TF. We lost Famous Daves and the Metro Grill's Philly Cheese Steak was way better than the Murray's Steak Sandwich.

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 08:51 AM by Dave Highlight this comment 298

My average cost to attend a ballgame is $26.00 for 2 tickets in Skyline view. $2.00 for 2 dogs @ Holiday Station. Peanuts $2.00. Bring in my own bottled water and or rum. A couple of diet cokes if bringing in some rum $10.00 bucks. Park for free! Total $40.00 a game for 2!!!LOL!

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 09:42 AM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 299

What are the odds of moving a couple of sections over in the skyline deck for 20 game season pack you think? I guess will find out in a month or so.

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 09:43 AM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 300

I didn't really even try the relocation. I guess it would make sense that everyone would almost be able to since there certainly won't be 24,000 FSE's for next year, but it just seemed like a hassle.

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 12:44 PM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 301

I would guess you can move in closer but probably at the cost of a higher row?
I just realized you said skyline deck. Did you mean skyline view? I thought the SD was off-limits for season tickets.

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 1:40 PM by robin Highlight this comment 302

Okay, I just saw your prior post. You must have meant skyline view in both posts. And I checked it out and the deck, like overlook and other cool sections, is only for individual and group purchases. Good luck in season relocation. My experience in skyline view is that the closer section is worth the higher row, up to a point.

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 1:45 PM by robin Highlight this comment 303

The price of taking the family to a Twins game if you're smart and know where to sit is no more outrageous than taking them to the evening movies.

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 2:24 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 304

And, let me add, the TF price is surprisingly comparable to the Metrodome (when you consider everything but the premium seating).

I just finished comparing my 2010 baseball expenses to 2009 (at my spouse's request), and I've now collected enough to talk about where I'm going to have to do an interim post tonight.

Writing the Big Review still feels like writing a book. And it also feels like writing something I should be getting paid lots of money for by the team who will benefit from the information. (Not holding my breath on that, of course.)

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 2:33 PM by Rick 305

I'm not sure where I would start comparing baseball expenses from year to year. Went to probably 8 games in 2009 and went to over 30 in 2010. Definitely spent a lot more on adult beverages this year as well.

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 3:48 PM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 306

Lot of the number crunching far as cost of going to a game has been done by research companies such as Team Marketing Report of Chicago, see link.

According to their research the Fan Cost Index, based on a family of four, increased by 21.8% up to $206.88 compared to 09 season.

The average price for a Twins ticket jumped by 45% from $21.70 to $31.47. The average premium ticket price rose to $70.74.

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 4:08 PM by Dave Highlight this comment 307

Yep meant skyline view seats. Looking to move down about 3 sections to 323 if I can.

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 4:52 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 308

Must say the $5.00 beer prices that some of the other clubs are charging is more reasonable fer sure!

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 4:55 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 309

In regards to the cost/location, I will forever miss my close view in Section 133, Row 3. I think we were paying $29.00/ticket to sit in relative location to what people were paying $77.00 in the first season at TF.

I can understand price increase, as that is all to be expected. However, I do not think the seating comfort or the amenities of the Dug Out Box are that great, but people will/are paying.

For now, I will be staying in our Section 123, Row 27* (as that is how far away it really is from the actual field) and swallow my pride of having close seats and spend the money I save on other things.

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 5:30 PM by tk Highlight this comment 310

I agree Rick. The Twins were long preparing us for the switch to a new ballpark. I remember the good old days when there were four price levels at "the other place". Lower Reserved, Upper Reserved, Lower GA and Upper GA. I think they had something like 8 or 9 in the last year, maybe even more.

Food prices were starting to get unpleasant over there a few years ago too. High prices for mediocre food. But, hey, at TF it's only a few days in a few months out of the year, right? might as well splurge...lol.

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 5:52 PM by luke Highlight this comment 311

Yup. I'm convinced that TwinkFan has a financial stake in one or more Holiday stores.

And he may be a rum importer as well.

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 6:36 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 312

In looking at the Ballpark Timeline we have towards the top of this post, I had a small concern. Great American Ballpark in Cincy is noted as a "retro" ballpark. Looking at one picture (click my name) it doesn't really look retro...it looks more like Progressive Field or Nationals Park with more steel work than retro brick facades and stuff.

Is there something about that place I'm missing??

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 9:40 PM by luke Highlight this comment 313

Dave,

Those averages are useful for broad trends, but they obscure important things (as numbers are sometimes wont to do).

My personal comparison is between similar games, with similar people, in a similar spot in the ballpark, eating roughly similar food. It's not statistical, but I think better reflects how I, personally, was affected financially by the move to TF. (Short answer: My budget overall was much bigger, but the per-event amount was astonishingly similar, with a couple of surprising category exceptions.)

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 10:07 PM by Rick 314

Luke,

The designation of any ballpark as "retro" is something of a subjective one. GAB is generally considered retro because of all the exposed steel and views like this one:


I suppose it's possible to view it as the leading edge of something less derivative, but I don't really see it that way. The designers went out of their way to make something which looked like a sort of steamboat-cum-ballpark.

In other words, brick is not the defining factor in the designation.

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 10:11 PM by Rick 315

It's 'retro' because it looks like a steam-powered ballpark?

Posted on November 16, 2010 at 10:30 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 316

twinkfan: 323, even 324, would be a great move. Hopefully all the lower and middle rows aren't taken, unless that's not an issue for you.
Re costs vs Metrodome, I'm guessing it would have cost me a lot more this year, per game and total cost, but in effect it was much cheaper because of the subsidy from selling unused tickets. At the Metrodome, that just added to the cost.

Posted on November 17, 2010 at 05:26 AM by robin Highlight this comment 317

Speaking of selling unused tickets ...

MLB really should have a rule stating you can not charge more than the face value of a ticket. All these season ticket brokers already have a built in profit(discount) in that they pay under face value.

I don't know of a single person who approves of the current legal scalping put in place. Well except for the scalpers and MLB.

Services like StubHub are a great idea, I have no complaints with the service itself. But what I would like to see is tickets only sold at face value or under. There can still be a fee accessed per ticket, I don't mind that. The purchaser would pay face value + a fee per ticket. The seller would get the face value and the fee would go to StubHub.

Posted on November 17, 2010 at 09:16 AM by dave Highlight this comment 318

If you compare lower reserved in the Metrodome to field box seats at TF, there was not much of an increase...Same with the home run porch.

My seats in section 116 at the Dome were $27 in 2008($29 in 2009) and they stayed the same for the first year at TF in 2010. For 2011, the Twins are raising them up to $31, still not much of a change...

IIRC, beer was $7 at the Metrodome, hot dogs are still in the same $3.50-$5.00 range...those traditional items such as nachos, pizza, hot dogs, pop and beer did not change much when going to Target Field.

Obviously, due to the configurations of the Metrodome, there are not many seating options to fairly compare other than home run porch and lower reserved. Even than, some of the lower reserved in the Metrodome was much closer than the field box seats are in TF due to the football design/configuration of the Metrodome.

Perhaps the biggest change was going from 50,000 seats in the Metrodome to 39,800 at Target Field. That alone is going to create a bigger demand as the supply decreased. You also lost out on 7,000+ "cheap seats"...

Overall, the prices did not change much from the Metrodome to Target Field when speaking of general seating and traditional ballpark fare.

The Dome lacked luxury seating and "specialty" concessions so its very difficult to compare in those ways.

The Twins still offer plenty of good deals as low as $12/game. You are not going to get much lower than that at ANY ballpark to see a major league game.

And you are allowed to carry in food and bottled water...I don't think a lot of fans realize that either. That alone can save a family quite a bit of money at a game.

Posted on November 17, 2010 at 09:24 AM by Mike Highlight this comment 319

Dave - prior to the StubHub agreement, many clubs had a resale system for season ticket holder much like you describe. Tickets could only be listed at STH cost. If the tickets sold, the STH got payment/account credit for the face value of the ticket and the buyer paid a percentage on top of that, which went to the club. It was a good deal for both, because the STH sold the tickets without a loss and the buyer got tickets for less than box office cost (and typically better tickets).

With the current StubHub arrangement, sellers listing at face are actually taking a loss, since the seller has to pay a 15% commission on the sale. MLB and the clubs don't have any incentive to see that change, because they get paid on the sales price.

I don't think limiting sale prices to face value is reasonable, for a few reasons. The Twins print the box office price of a ticket on season tickets (except for LC); some clubs put the discounted STH cost - which is properly considered "face"? I also believe that STHs should be able to make some profit on tickets to offset potential losses from tickets that can't be used. An STH does take a significant risk purchasing an entire season up front (and yes, they get some value from that in the form of a discount).

I would favor restrictions that prevent or minimize people from buying season tickets for the primary purpose of SH and other secondary market resales.

I would love to see the SH seller fee eliminated, as you suggest, but I just don't see that happening.

Posted on November 17, 2010 at 11:29 AM by jfh Highlight this comment 320

jfh - I'd group STH's into four general types:

1)Corporate - Tickets are either used by employees, clients, go unused, or donated. Rarely are they ever sold.
2)Full Brokers - Never used, mostly sold. If they can't sell, go unused or possibly donate.
3)Partial Brokers - Use a few tickets, sell most of them. Like to sell enough to cover the cost of the games they attend. Donate if they have too.
4)Fans - Either attend all the games personally or have a preset group of people they share tickets with. Rarely sell or donate because they match their package size to their needs rather than playing the broker game.

I'm fine with 1 & 4, despise 2 & 3. It's only the 2 & 3 types that are taking any sort of risk. And in my humble opinion, MLB and the Twins should not be supporting those types of STH.

Posted on November 17, 2010 at 12:38 PM by dave Highlight this comment 321

Good points, JFH. If the seller has to take below face or cost from stubhub for the lesser value tickets, he/she will go elsewhere to sell the higher value game tickets. The buyer (which includes me often) can't expect to get the market value when it is lower than the seller's cost, and at the same time insist on getting below market value for the premium games. I often give away or sell tickets cheap, and I sometimes have to pay up if I don't have the tickets I need for a particular game. So if there is a window of opportunity to get that back for some games, why not? Buy a package of games from the Twins or from a season ticket holder, and you get a good price but share the risks, including weather, and interest costs. It's probably cheaper not to be a season ticket holder (most years) and pay the ticket office or market price for the games you want. I do agree about STH for resale only, however, and it appears something may be done about that.

Posted on November 17, 2010 at 12:48 PM by robin Highlight this comment 322

I think last year probably made it tough to gauge who falls into what category. For a while tickets on Stubhub were going for so much money that a lot of regular season ticket holders probably saw dollar signs and sold a lot. MLB makes it so easy to sell your seats and why not price them at market? Then this season the Twins are going in and cancelling peoples seats because they sold too many or maybe don't live here? I don't get it.

Next year should be better. Selling the standing rooms this year really lowered secondary ticket prices and definitely helped. Next year there will be less STH's so.

Posted on November 17, 2010 at 1:06 PM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 323

Gardy gets manager of the year.

Posted on November 17, 2010 at 1:13 PM by Grizzly Adams Highlight this comment 324

Which shows you that they should wait until after the playoffs to vote. With the way the Twins' season ended, sorry, but who cares.

K

Posted on November 17, 2010 at 6:28 PM by Kramer Highlight this comment 325

And it's about high time Gardy got Manager of the Year...

Posted on November 17, 2010 at 9:07 PM by luke Highlight this comment 326

Cubs unveiled plans for an "upgraded" Wrigley Field, but can't find a way to pay for it. Is Target Field quickly becoming the front-runner for the 2014 All-Star Game?

Posted on November 17, 2010 at 9:31 PM by downfall Highlight this comment 327

If the Cubs are going to take out the ramps and widen concourses then how will people get to the second level? Elevators?

Posted on November 18, 2010 at 09:05 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 328

dave - I agree with you regarding 1&4. However, as a 4, I disagree with the point that there is no risk in that group. There is always the risk associated with replacing a partner that drops out and the financial impact that goes along with that. Other than corporate account, most people that want seats that are only sold full season have to run a group (or join one).

If I could get my HPB seats as a quarter season, I would. Until I'm local to the TC, I'm don't see how I'm going to make more than 10-15 games a year. I suspect that there are many HPB account holders that would rather have a 20 or 40 game plan.

If clubs want to minimize the Sunday brokers, there needs to be more packaging of seats done by the clubs.

robin - to your point, you are probably correct that it is cheaper in most cases to just buy games you really want to go to. If you look at fan groups for the Yankees and the Mets, this seems to have become the preferred method (perhaps because of upfront cost).

I used to do that, but found that I go to more games as an STH, probably because my average ticket cost is less and I get more "value" and most of the time I have better seats than what I could otherwise get. (And, a few years ago, I went to 65 or so games and that's not really practical without season tickets).

Posted on November 18, 2010 at 10:54 AM by jfh Highlight this comment 329

I love Gardy but man has that guy benefited from a weak central division.

Posted on November 19, 2010 at 10:54 AM by James1979 Highlight this comment 330

The Twins are once again offering the "Guaranteed Giveaway" package/program. STH types once again have the opportunity to acquire a nice water bottle (or DQ cap) without having to stand in line at the game - and for only $58.00!

Posted on November 19, 2010 at 11:37 AM by Ben Highlight this comment 331

Ben - I don't even think that is a decision that needs to be made this year. $58 seems a little too high for "approximately 8 items" as the Twins state...two of which will more than likely be DQ caps. Add on another straw cowboy hat sponsored by WE-Fest as well as the usual kids "jersey".

I wonder if they will even have a bobblehead(s) this year....If so, what bobbleheads are they going to have? Denard Span? Danny Valencia? A special 1991 team set?

They already had a mini Target Field last year.

Perhaps they might have some nice giveaway items for the 1991 World Series 20-year Reunion weekend on August 5-8 but other than that, I don't see any reason to purchase the guaranteed giveaway this year.

A good SGA would be a "Twins choke collar" at the end of September sponsored by the New York Yankees...

Posted on November 19, 2010 at 12:19 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 332

The only thing that the made the deal bearable last year was the inclusion of the M & P bobblehead (assuming you were eventually able to get one that was not in several pieces) and the "Mini TF". The water bottle was a sour joke at best and kids items should not be included in a package offered to adults. So, yeah, most likely two DQ caps (as always), yet another straw hat (yawn), and almost certainly a kiddie jersey, but then what? The Twins have all but officially announced that bobbleheads are over (as well as the "bronze" statues) and the TF model would be a one-time deal. A lure would be nice and maybe they are going to do something worthwhile for the '91 deal (more likely, however, is another retail team set of bobbleheads), but I suspect most of us won't get fooled again.

Posted on November 19, 2010 at 1:52 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 333

At the end of the email the Twins state - "Guaranteed "giveaway" collection will not include Bobbleheads, figurines, or breakable items."

Posted on November 19, 2010 at 2:17 PM by Go Go Twins Highlight this comment 334

I did this deal last year and was nervous about it, but it was nice to get the mini TF along with M&P, but not sure I am going to risk it this year with uncertainty of the ROI. I would much rather spend $58 on the secondary market for the one/two items I would actually use.

The Twins could definitely sweetin' this deal up with putting a drawing or other opportunities to those purchase it. However, from what I've seen in these latest promotions, it appears they are trying to kill off the program, while still making it profitable until it ceases to exist.

Posted on November 19, 2010 at 3:05 PM by tk Highlight this comment 335

Football at Wrigley tomorrow...using only one end zone. That should be interesting.

Posted on November 19, 2010 at 4:41 PM by luke Highlight this comment 336

Arizona Fall League championship game at Scottsdale Stadium on MLB network today. Peoria Javelinas versus Scottsdale Scorpions. Coverage starts @ 1:30 CST. Replays Monday (11/22) @ 2am & 12pm.

Posted on November 20, 2010 at 11:25 AM by Buzz Highlight this comment 337

I was watching the Gopher/UNC game friday night and couldn't believe the similarities between Target Field and the Coliseo de Perto Rico's exteriors (link). The decal at center court even looked as if it could be used for Target Field. Did anyone else happen to observe this or am I already going thru Target Field withdrawls?

Posted on November 20, 2010 at 9:17 PM by Kingduck Highlight this comment 338

kingduck, i see the similarities too. Well, the arena's Wikipedia page does list HOK as one of the architects.

Posted on November 22, 2010 at 1:01 PM by pawelk12 Highlight this comment 339

Site suffered 33 hours down due to a nuclear server meltdown in Dallas...

Considering what happened yesterday at the Dome, it was apparently the weekend for nuclear meltdowns.

Posted on November 22, 2010 at 1:10 PM by Rick 340

Luckily that nuclear server meltdown also took Childress with it.

Posted on November 22, 2010 at 1:19 PM by AJ Highlight this comment 341

Wouldn't a Favre retirement be just the perfect thing to get later this afternoon?

Posted on November 22, 2010 at 1:21 PM by Rick 342

Sorry Rick,

But no it wouldn't because we would then be stuck with T-Jackson for the rest of the season.

Posted on November 22, 2010 at 1:58 PM by Duffman Highlight this comment 343

The Favre show has jumped the shark. Time to move on. At least it will become more clear what needs to happen in the offseason.

Posted on November 22, 2010 at 2:05 PM by Rick 344

Favre will be named player/coach. That way his streak will last forever. Play when he wants, practice when he wants and show up for Two-a-days when he wants.

Kingduck, I commented on the same thing. My son said I was nuts. I definately think the graphic at Centercourt looks similar to the TF images that have been used. This is just going to be a long winter.

Posted on November 22, 2010 at 2:10 PM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 345

Favre would be more useful as two bars of soap.

Posted on November 22, 2010 at 2:41 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 346

Favre is playing just as crappy as T Jack probably would be. It really doesn't matter at this point.

Posted on November 22, 2010 at 3:21 PM by AJ Highlight this comment 347

I noticed some TF/Coliseo similarities at first, but didn't take a real close look until I heard Morneau complain about how hard it was to hit a 3 with the lines painted where they were...

Posted on November 22, 2010 at 4:05 PM by schweady Highlight this comment 348

Oh, SNAP!!!

Posted on November 22, 2010 at 7:58 PM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 349

Did you guys see the Business Journal article this week about the $42M renovation to the Ford Centre?

Posted on November 23, 2010 at 4:00 PM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 350

I did see that article. It neglected to mention that the Pohlads own the company which owns that building (a pertinent detail, I think).

I have also seen schematic drawings of how a transit station might be incorporated into the building. Not sure if that's real or just conceptual. Here's an example:


Posted on November 23, 2010 at 4:21 PM by Rick 351

The article did mention United Properties as purchasing it in 2007. Is there political concern they are discreetly hiding from the general public by not stating it outright? Not sure what that would be?

Posted on November 23, 2010 at 5:25 PM by TK Highlight this comment 352

My brother told me the funniest joke today. Stop me if you've heard this one:

Q: What do the Minnesota Vikings and Billy Graham have in common?
A: Both can fill a stadium with 70,000 people, make them stand up and shout "Jesus Christ!"

Posted on November 23, 2010 at 6:11 PM by luke Highlight this comment 353

Here's a Ford Centre follow-up from today. Still no Pohlad mention.

I don't think anybody is trying to hide anything. It's just that, if you're going to claim this upgrade as something stimulated by Target Field (which this article implies), it seems worth mentioning that it's the Twins owners who are both doing the upgrade and benefiting from it.

In other words, it's all in the family, so to speak.

Posted on November 23, 2010 at 10:05 PM by Rick 354

The Minneapolis Business Journal had the article that I saw, and they stated on more than one occasion that it was owned by the Pohlads. They weren't seeming to hide anything. Said construction will start in December and take a year. Hopefully most of the visible renovation is done by baseball season...get it looking purdy.

I do think that sooner or later the big transit facility will happen.

Posted on November 24, 2010 at 09:14 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 355

I think it's great to build a transit facility, but don't we need to improve the system before we worry about building capacity for more people? I've said before this one track train that only runs for a relatively short distance just isn't that practical. Why not invest in expanding the function of the rail itself before we worry about how we corral the relatively small number of users.

Getting people out of the gate and onto the train is a separate topic.

Posted on November 24, 2010 at 09:59 AM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 356

Rumor has it that its between the Twins and Red Sox for the rights to Tsuyoshi Nishioka. His Japanese team has until December 1st to accept the bid.

Posted on November 24, 2010 at 3:29 PM by Jeff Highlight this comment 357

JCTwins, good luck expanding anything mass transit related now that Republicans control the Minnesota House and Senate. They hate anything that isn't roads because light and commuter rail don't pay for themselves. Of course, roads don't pay for themselves either, but they conveniently ignore that fact.

Posted on November 24, 2010 at 10:11 PM by Buffalo Highlight this comment 358

Buffalo,

Roads do pay for themselves throught the gas tax. Lawyered.

Posted on November 25, 2010 at 03:30 AM by Duffman Highlight this comment 359

Roads don't pay for themselves, WE pay for them. Your lawyering is overthrown. ;-)

Happy Thanksgiving, everyone. Hope you all have a great day.

Posted on November 25, 2010 at 07:55 AM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 360

Heh...they are already dreaming up new taxes for roads. MnDOT and the transportation industry are quite scared of the Volt and their kin. The per gallon gas tax model doesn't work if folks get 90 MPG.

Posted on November 25, 2010 at 09:30 AM by Lincster Highlight this comment 361

Speaking of roads, Google maps streetview photos have been updated. You can do a virtual drive around TF circa October 2009 during construction.

Posted on November 25, 2010 at 12:08 PM by Buzz Highlight this comment 362

Too bad the Volt wont make it in Minnesota. The first time those $5,000 batteries freeze people will be revolting.

Posted on November 26, 2010 at 07:15 AM by James1979 Highlight this comment 363

Twins unveil new road alternate digs for next year. I think they look pretty good! Clicky to view!

Posted on November 26, 2010 at 09:45 AM by firedog Highlight this comment 364

Meh...

Posted on November 26, 2010 at 11:09 AM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 365

Eh, the jersey looks ok. I wonder what a black Twins jersey would look like. That'd be interesting IMO.
James1979 - I haven't heard a rim shot like that since the Vikings took the field against the Packers.

Posted on November 26, 2010 at 12:46 PM by luke Highlight this comment 366

Twins secure negotiating rights for Nishioka with $5 million bid

Looks like we are still actively trying to improve the team at all of the postions.

Posted on November 26, 2010 at 12:58 PM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 367

youtube highlights: Tsuyoshi Nishioka of Chiba Lotte Marines. Shortstop. Bats right. Throws right.

Posted on November 26, 2010 at 2:20 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 368

james1979 - oh so the volt will make it in michigan, but not in minnesota? ahh okay smart guy. get a clue bro.

p.s. are the twins really that oblivious to the fact that their blue alternate jerseys are just plain silly looking? one of the worst road alternate jerseys in the majors. the blue jersey is lame and looks like a clown outfit.

Posted on November 26, 2010 at 2:30 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 369

Agreed that new road jersey doesn't do it for me. The Minnesota looks forced and out of place, like it doesn't fit properly or something. Maybe it will look better on a real player.

Posted on November 26, 2010 at 2:41 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 370

Nishioka, 26, is a speedy switch hitter who can play both shortstop and second base.

Posted on November 26, 2010 at 2:59 PM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 371

And hopefully, if signed, he'll be playing second. Losing Hardy would be a big mistake.

Posted on November 26, 2010 at 4:18 PM by AJ Highlight this comment 372

"oh so the volt will make it in michigan, but not in minnesota? ahh okay smart guy. get a clue bro."

No, you get a clue. These cars will be worthless up here near Duluth when the weather dips to -40. I'm sure the people in the U.P. of Mich will avoid the Volt too.

Posted on November 27, 2010 at 01:44 AM by James1979 Highlight this comment 373

Who says it will make it anywhere? I know everyone agrees that we need to create more fuel efficient vehicles and lessen our dependence on foreign oil, but it'll be a long time before these prohibitively expensive vehicles beecome widespread. Can the manufacturers and dealers wait 10-15 years, or however long it takes for the technology becomes affordable to regular consumers?
I applaud the efforts, the initiative, and the motivations, but they're up aagainst some pretty long odds and strong economic obsticles.

Posted on November 27, 2010 at 07:10 AM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 374

As far as the Volt goes...I suppose now that every gas station in the world will have to convert to have a "re-charging" station as well?
The traffic authority would have to make new signs saying "re-charge here".
Or the best one yet: The CarMaster 3000! About the size of a laptop, carry it in your Volt, and you can recharge your phone, iPod, laptop and your Volt all with one device! WiFi and Bluetooth capable. Comes in five designer colors. Only $299.99!

The Volt will go nowhere and will go there fast IMO.

Posted on November 27, 2010 at 08:59 AM by luke Highlight this comment 375

Ooops. Looks like I found Motorweek's website by mistake....

Assuming we sign "Nish" and resign Hardy that puts Casilla as our super-utility guy. I like this spot for him as he always plays better when he has to earn his time.

He seems to slack off when he's given the job on a full-time basis.

K

Posted on November 27, 2010 at 10:15 AM by Kramer Highlight this comment 376

You may be on to something with that assessment of Casilla.

Posted on November 27, 2010 at 1:04 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 377

james1979: i would venture maybe (and that is a big maybe) 10% of the population of minnesota (at most) lives in the northern half of minnesota. same goes with the population of the upper peninsula of michigan. boiled down, the volt really only needs to "work" then in minneapolis and detroit since that is where the overwhelming majority of people live in those two states.

Posted on November 28, 2010 at 04:33 AM by Betaband Highlight this comment 378

Minneapolis is only 360,000 people in a state populated by over 4 million, so I'm assuming you really mean "Twin Cities metropolitan area" when you simply say Minneapolis. We'd hate to see you slight the majority of Hennepin County or the metro area population here. But what happens when those people leave the metro area? How far can they get on a charge? Could they visit the Mayo Clinic and get back on a single charge? How much will a charge cost? Where outside of the metro area could one get a charge if they have to leave town? Do they take a regular internal combustion engine powered vehicle on such trips instead? If so, what would be the point of buying an electric car?
It's like a hybrid vehicle in that sense. They're a boon in town, but if one spends a lot of time on the freeways, or highways outside the metro area, there's not much saving going on since the ICE is in use and not the electric motor.

Posted on November 28, 2010 at 11:13 AM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 379

Really don't want to add to a car thread here, but since this general readership is obviously clueless on the subject...

Cars like the Volt aren't only electric. When you deplete your charge the gas-chugging engine kicks in. Right now, car charging stations (a la gas stations) wouldn't work, as it takes several hours to charge your electric car.

OK.. who wants to talk scrapbooking? Luke??

Posted on November 28, 2010 at 12:41 PM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 380

UY TTH

Posted on November 28, 2010 at 2:29 PM by luke Highlight this comment 381

Well --- if someone wants to discuss Halsey getting suckered to The Battle Off Cape Engano, I'm ready.

Posted on November 28, 2010 at 3:55 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 382

While I like the new road alternates, couldn't they have made the "Minnesota" script white instead of red just like the had with the road alternates used from 1997 through 2008?

Way too much red and blue on that new alternate...

Posted on November 28, 2010 at 6:51 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 383

They should have just made the grays out of the lighter material. That's why the players didn't like wearing them, they were too heavy in the heat on the road.

Posted on November 28, 2010 at 7:39 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 384

Mike - I have to agree with that assessment. What I think might have been even nicer is a red jersey with white script.

Posted on November 28, 2010 at 9:10 PM by luke Highlight this comment 385

Yuck no thanks on the red jerseys. Gross

I actually liked the blue aways last year when they put the white around the edges of the Twins logo. I assume that the new blues means Pavano is gone since he always chose to wear it? JK

Hall of Fame vote will be announced at 1 today. Will Bert finally get in? If he does, will he get a gate/statue at TF?

Posted on November 29, 2010 at 10:12 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 386

Although I think the StarTrib article saying that may be wrong. I haven't seen coverage anywhere else about the HOF

Posted on November 29, 2010 at 10:13 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 387

StarTrib updated...ballot is out today but won't know for a whole. That's what I had thought.

Still though, assuming he gets in does he get a gate/statue? Will be cool to have his number retired and add another number to the admin building face

Posted on November 29, 2010 at 10:27 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 388

The ST article is correct (says the ballot will be announced today) but the headline is misleading because it says the results of the voting will be announced. Poor editing.

Posted on November 29, 2010 at 10:27 AM by Stevie B Highlight this comment 389

Stevie B,

Reason #1 editors should not be the one to write headlines....

Posted on November 29, 2010 at 11:21 AM by tk Highlight this comment 390

Does anyone know when the Twins plan to release their single game ticket prices, or have any information in regards to this?

Posted on November 29, 2010 at 1:50 PM by tk Highlight this comment 391

Single game prices should be released in the next couple of weeks I would think. Single game tickets are tentatively scheduled to go on sale on Saturday, March 19 from what I read in the Star Tribune not long ago.

The ST prices have already been released, so it shouldn't be very difficult to guess what the single game prices will run based on previous years.

We all know there will be a 3 or 4 pricing-tier system again with premium games being Yankees, Red Sox, Brewers, Dodgers(?) and any other weekend games from Memorial Day thru Labor Day. In fact, I would not be surprised if the Twins added even more "premium" games to the 2010 schedule.

The cheaper games will be weeknights in April/May/September.

The mid-tier games will be weekends in April/May/September and weekdays from Memorial Day thru Labor Day.

Posted on November 29, 2010 at 2:09 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 392

Mike,

With the price point research that was conducted to gauge ticket pricing, etc. I was wondering if the Twins may go the route of other clubs to avoid strong secondary market pricing hikes.

For example, the Brewers:

Brewers Ticket Prices 2011

Field Infield Box:
*Existing STH: $42
*New STH: $44
*Individual price: $50
*Marquee: $80

Obviously, the Twins are not going to have a new STH pricing, but how far will they go with the Marquee matchups? They have never gone terribly high on price, but how far will they go to avoid secondary market and capture some of that income?

I doubt they would ever go as high as the Brewers at almost 100% from what STH pay.

I guess we will just have to wait and see.

Posted on November 29, 2010 at 2:48 PM by tk Highlight this comment 393

Keep in mind that the Twins have hired a dynamic pricing consultant to maximize revenues. I wouldn't be a bit surprised to see more variety in prices based on:

- opponent
- time of year
- day of week
- time of day
- general anticipated demand

I also wouldn't be surprised to see walk-up purchases priced differently from orders placed in advance.

The team has access to all of the Stubhub data from last year, and you have to believe that they will be trying to close the gaps between what they got for selling the ticket the first time and what someone else got for selling it on the secondary market.

And with a payroll set to come in around $125 million, it's about to get a lot more expensive to see the Twins play in person. (Not that this is any surprise.)

Posted on November 29, 2010 at 2:54 PM by Rick 394

I have only seen a small little smidgen about it, nothing in any substantial form, but SportsBusiness Journal is reporting that the Marlins' whale of a stadium will have multi-colored seats.
What I'm not sure of is whether different sections will have different colors (every third section red, odd sections teal, even sections yellow, etc.) or if it will be pre-Norm Green Met Center multi colored, where there are different seat colors in every section.
I'm not so sure how I feel about the idea, either way...
If I find out more, I'll link to it. The Journal is subscription-based so I could only see so much of the article.

Posted on November 29, 2010 at 4:58 PM by luke Highlight this comment 395

I will predict 45-50 for Diamond Box. STH price is 40. Last year STH 38 and single game 43-48. Similar extrapolations for other sections could be made. I'm guessing/hoping that the larger fluctuations to be expected from the "dynamic pricing consultant" or program will apply to day of game sales, special promos, etc. Or later revisions to a more standard pricing structure available to early buyers when they go on sale. We might see some revised prices when the weather forecast is bad, an opponent becomes more or less appealing, etc.

Posted on November 29, 2010 at 5:19 PM by robin Highlight this comment 396

but then there could be PR problems, both for extremely high prices, and for very low prices when others presumably bought earlier at a higher price.
Maybe the system will settle at a price range somewhere between standard prices and secondary market prices.

Posted on November 29, 2010 at 5:23 PM by robin Highlight this comment 397

On dynamic pricing....with 24,000 FSE season tickets sold, don't you think they've already missed the boat on capturing a lot of the market gap? They have 15,000 tickets per game to sell. A lot of those are in the outfield or in the upper deck well down the lines. Maybe it is worth it to have more confusing price structures, but its not like they have a ton of $50 seats that they could get a $100 for....those $50 seats are already sold to season ticket holders.

It is interesting looking at the Brewers pricing. The "club" seats with waitstaff are only $28. I have no idea if those are really equivalent to the legend club seats, but they are half the price. The Brewers had another good attendance season, and sold 3M tickets in 2009, so its just interesting.

Posted on November 29, 2010 at 8:34 PM by Lincster Highlight this comment 398

Maybe this is old news and already covered, but the Twins seem to be trying to keep some of the scalper tickets. The "brokers" must be the ones with dozens of tickets in their hand every night? I can't imagine how some of them make money, but they must.

Posted on November 29, 2010 at 9:36 PM by Lincster Highlight this comment 399

Sorry...one more for tonight. Here is a good article about how the Giants are using dynamic pricing. It blows my original post to shreds -- they are using it for exactly the types of seats that the Twins have left to sell. Very interesting.

Click my name for the link

Posted on November 29, 2010 at 9:53 PM by Lincster Highlight this comment 400

Interesting article. I think it pretty much validates my speculation. There is the season ticket prices, the standard individual game prices determined before season starts (which in recent years could be called "variable" pricing, in a rough way, like Twins premium, select and value), and then as the season progresses they make fine-tuned adjustments based on changes in the attractiviness of an opposing team (or player), weather conditions, etc. They even mention the "pr" importance of not alienating their fan base, esp. STHs. The traditional way of pricing makes large scale scalping inevitable, even an enhancement to market efficiency. This won't eliminate it but will close much of the gaps (i.e., grossly overpriced or underpriced tickets, which the scalpers currently arbitrage, albeit at risk of loss). It seems to make sense but I think a lot of general ticket buyers and fans will be annoyed, and as with gas prices, will be furious at large increases and take for granted, or as an entitlement, declining or stable prices.

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 05:57 AM by robin Highlight this comment 401

How many FSE's do you think they will actually have this year? You have to assume some drop off from last year.

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 08:46 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 402

PatMeares,

It will be tough to say, the Twins dropped many of the "brokers" who had many sets of season tickets. In the article Lincster shared, it spoke of how the Twins limited Season Ticket sales to 25,000 and have not set this years max, but could be the about same. I would doubt they would get that high, unless people join in groups.

I have not seen a heavy marketing push for Season Tickets, so they must be satisfied where they are at, in likely hopes of making larger profit margins with single game tickets.

I wonder how many people are in the "On Deck Circle"?

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 09:59 AM by tk Highlight this comment 403

There were approximately 2,000 people on the "On Deck Circle" waiting list back in October. I remember reading that from a quote from DSP in the Star Tribune.

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 10:14 AM by Mike Highlight this comment 404

Tk,

Season ticket upgrade/relocation does not take place until next week for season ticket holders. My guess is they are waiting for their big season ticket advertising until after that occurs, since they can't begin selling new season tickets until after the current ones are set.

After that happens, then they will start working off their On-deck circle. If they exhaust the waiting list, which I would think may be likely. If they don't, I'm sure you will just see a few ads here and there telling people to join the waiting list.

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 10:24 AM by Duffman Highlight this comment 405

Did you guys see the Twins tweet that they are installing limestone below the Met club. They had a picture but it sucked.

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 11:31 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 406

That is a pretty terrible picture...

It was hard to picture when they described it in the press release, and it's no easier to picture now.

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 11:38 AM by Rick 407

Here's what it looked like originally:


Posted on November 30, 2010 at 11:42 AM by Rick 408

I spoke with a rep about ST for next year. I was told the 2500 number for On-Deck circle. Looking in HPB, the rep is saying he can't promise anything on the basis of getting through this list. Last year they didn't even sell out HPB, so I have trouble believing it will be full this time around, either.

Come relocation time I'll be interested in how much improvement people are getting. What is the earliest anyone has for improvement selection?

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 12:07 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 409

JCTwins,

I have not seen anything yet, I think I recall that they are sending out the e-mails tomorrow?

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 12:17 PM by tk Highlight this comment 410

Ah, this clears it up a bit:


Posted on November 30, 2010 at 12:22 PM by Rick 411

The limestone will be a nice touch there, but it depends on what specifically it will cover (or leave bare).

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 12:23 PM by tk Highlight this comment 412

(For clarity: That's the concept drawing for the addition of limestone.)

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 12:23 PM by Rick 413

It also appears that the closed captioning ribbon board will be moved up and out of the way of the limestone expansion.

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 12:26 PM by Rick 414

I am wondering, and maybe hoping, if this is phase one of an annual project to cover the blah gray facing with limestone. Doing all of it may be overkill, which might be why they are doing just a small piece to start. I would have to think that if they can demonstrate an annual improvement that will meet the requirement in the deal made by the Twins to maintain and improve.

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 12:27 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 415

I believe the relocation information will go out in an e-mail tomorrow. Everyone that signed up for the relocation process was to receive a specific time and day that they will then be able to view the options available and then decide to relocate or stay in the same seats for 2011.

It will be interesting to see what types of seats will be available, with the ticket brokers now limited to only 4 seats. Just from casually looking at Stubhub throughout the season it looked like many brokers had complete rows of 12 or more tickets in some sections.

I am happy with my seat location and signed up primarily because I just wanted to see what was available. I am curious about how the process will work. Obviously my seat location will not be listed as available. So anyone making a selection prior to me would not have them as an option. If when my time does come, I make a move those people with selection times after me would have different options that those selecting before me. I don't know if we can automatically assume that those people with seniority will necessarily have the best seats and those farther down the priority list would have worse locations. Do you think that they will mark in some way the seats of people that have shown interest in the relocation process so that you can then select their location if they do decide to move, or would this just make things too complicated? Apparently the whole process will be done online.

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 12:28 PM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 416

I would GUESS the relocation software will automatically "move people" and then the Twins may go back in and make sure everything functions once a day and catch any errors/issues/glitches.

If there's a way to post a screen cap of the map that would be great. I am a silent partner, so unfortunately not able to do my own seats myself.

In Home Plate Box I know we had a whole row of around 16 seats owned by a broker.

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 12:33 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 417

Yes looking forward to my e-mail tommorow. I wonder if they give you the choices for 20 game pack or if you have to stay with the same pack you had last year? In other words may find good seats only with 20 game pack A instead of current C package. Should be interesting to see how it all shakes out!

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 12:48 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 418

I think in the end, there will ultimately be little movement, especially early on in the process. People will look at the "availability" of upgrading and will quickly realize there will not be much available to upgrade to.

I am thinking of moving from my current section 103, row 20 on the first base side to section 125 on the third base side...however, I highly doubt anything "better" will be available in 125 so I will more than likely stay put for 2011.

I have been told numerous times by several ticket reps that my best bet would be to keep my current seats and that is more than likely what I will end up doing.

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 2:25 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 419

I didn't even try to move just because I didn't want to mess with it. I really like my seats, although I guess I could be closer for the same price. Just wasn't really sure it was worth it.

I am ready for Opening Day though!

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 2:41 PM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 420

Well I'm for sure going to stay on the 3rd base side. I sat a few times along the 1st base side for some early games and about froze to death with no sun there. Felt about 20 degrees warmer in the sun!

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 4:34 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 421

Take it easy, TTH; but I read this morning doing my usual sports business news gathering that the blogger that spilled out the idea that the Marlins' whale of a new ballpark will have multi-colored seating, actually kinda had it wrong.
It's not the seats that will be multicolored, rather the fascia behind the sections of seats that will be multicolored.
He reports that all seats in Whale Stadium (nice name for that place, eh?) will be blue.

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 4:45 PM by luke Highlight this comment 422

For further proof:

Traction: http://www.fishstripes.com/2010/11/29/1842224/marlins-new-stadium-colorful-seats

Retraction: http://www.fishstripes.com/2010/11/30/1846662/marlins-new-stadium-colorful-seats-part-ii

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 4:49 PM by luke Highlight this comment 423

luke - I made no comment regarding your post regarding colored seats. Don't know what you're referring to.

Posted on November 30, 2010 at 10:56 PM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 424

Great post Rick,
I haven't been here in a while. I was happy to see betaband is posting, has anyone told him the Badgers are going to the Rose Bowl?

Posted on December 1, 2010 at 12:15 AM by dirwin7 Highlight this comment 425

Yeah, but, but, but...Fifty years ago...

Posted on December 1, 2010 at 02:13 AM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 426

actually TTH, it was pre-emptive. Usually you DO make snide comments about what I say around here, so I nipped it in the bud early.

Posted on December 1, 2010 at 06:45 AM by luke Highlight this comment 427

November meeting minutes were posted by the Ballpark Authority. Click my name.

Listed below are some of the more interesting points from the meeting

Concession numbers were very strong for food and beverages and Delaware North will continue with a focus on local foods and more Minnesota products next season.

Construction of the second Tradition Wall is underway on the plaza and an additional sculpture will be added before Opening Day 2011. Some changes to the buffet in the Legends Club will take place next year along with additional portable food and beverage carts in the ballpark and on the Roof Deck.

Tours will continue through Christmas, and there are over 300 holiday events taking place at Target Field this season.

Target Field recycled or composted 2,142 tons of stadium waste. 65.5% of waste was diverted and the rest incinerated for steam for energy purposes.

Posted on December 1, 2010 at 09:53 AM by Jeff Highlight this comment 428

From the Ballpark Authority -

Open house for the interchange project -
You are invited to join us to view project materials and provide feedback on project purpose and need, vision and goals, data collected and preliminary concepts.

Click my name for the details.

Posted on December 1, 2010 at 09:55 AM by Jeff Highlight this comment 429

I love almost everything about this ballpark, but I must register one complaint that I hope they plan on addressing soon: the concourses at Target Field look exactly like the inside of a Target store. They are utterly charmless and speak nothing of the fact that the nation's pastime is played just a few feet away. Get a decorator in there and spruce that place up! I understand that Target Field isn't a "retro park", but does that mean that it needs to be bland and sterile? Understated for "Minnesota tastes" is one thing, but the aesthetic of the concourses is bordering on monkish asceticism. Please liven it up Twins.

Posted on December 1, 2010 at 1:00 PM by Paul Wilbome Highlight this comment 430

Thanks Jeff for reminding us/posting those links. They are very informative and I put the interchange meeting on my calendar, just for kicks (and I get to go into TF so I feel a little summer).

PW...I totally agree. I think it will be year 4 before they address design issues. That said, I'm glad they are putting their money into heaters on the upper concourse first. It is much colder up there in the chilly months than down below with the open concourse. My seats are in the upper deck and I really like them, but I'll welcome the heaters on occasion.

Posted on December 1, 2010 at 7:44 PM by Lincster Highlight this comment 431

Anybody get the e-mail for seat relocation yet?

Posted on December 2, 2010 at 10:36 AM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 432

No e-mails so far.

I guess the key word is "Around". Two or three days before or after the first will still fall within their time frame.

"Around December 1st, you will be sent an email detailing information about the online relocation process"

Posted on December 2, 2010 at 10:50 AM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 433

Twins re-sign Repko for $600K

Posted on December 2, 2010 at 1:50 PM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 434

Pitchers Francisco Liriano, Matt Capps, Kevin Slowey, Pat Neshek, Glen Perkins and Clay Condrey, infielders J.J. Hardy and Alexi Casilla, and outfielders Delmon Young and Jason Repko are all eligible for arbitration this winter. The majority of that group is expected to be tendered contacts, but there are a few question marks as the deadline approaches.

OK what do you think we do here? They signed Repko. For sure they do not offer abritration to Nesheck,Condrey,Perkins! Maybe not JJ?

Posted on December 2, 2010 at 3:08 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 435

It's been written about extensively the past few days. They'd be stupid to non-tender Hardy. Most seem to want him to be a Twin next year (for good reasons, imo), but even if they absolutely HAVE to have a scarppy little fast guy at SS instead, Hardy has definite trade value.

Posted on December 2, 2010 at 4:32 PM by BR Highlight this comment 436

White Sox: Adam Dunn and his 30+ HR and 100 RBI
Twins: Jason Repko and Japan's version of Ricky Rubio

Not a good start.

Posted on December 2, 2010 at 4:51 PM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 437

Yeah, it sounds like Hardy will be tendered, whether he's on the team next year is another thing. I would hate that though. I want him to be a Twin next year, no trade at all. I want him signed for three years, if possible.

TwinkFan-
Neshek received a contract too, $625,000. They basically needed to. The bullpen is so up in the air, that is a cheap price and they're probably hoping he just needed more time. I am not quite sure he'll ever get it back because of his delivery, but I would take that gamble on that price every time.

Posted on December 2, 2010 at 4:56 PM by AJ Highlight this comment 438

The Twins had no non-tenders. All nine of their arbitration players were tendered contracts. Clay Condrey was outrighted a month ago and elected free agency.

Not much of a surprise.

Posted on December 2, 2010 at 10:39 PM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 439

Giving Dunn that much money will hamper them from signing other players though...including possibly Konerko. Personally I've stopped really worrying about other teams acquisitions. We'll be fine.

Posted on December 3, 2010 at 10:27 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 440

Sad news. Ron Santo dead. No Cooperstown for him.

Posted on December 3, 2010 at 12:27 PM by robin Highlight this comment 441

Personally I've stopped really worrying about other teams acquisitions. We'll be fine.

I firmly believe there will be a year, possibly in the not too distant future, where the Twins are the 2010 Vikings. Everyone around here is used to them being a 1st place team that we've forgotten everyone else in the division wants to win as badly, if not more, than this team.

Posted on December 3, 2010 at 1:16 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 442

Just got an e-mail regarding the seat relocation. Here is what it says
There has been a issue with the email going out through MLB. Look for it to hit today or at the latest Monday. If it goes out on Monday you will receive and email explaining the technical issue. Hmmmm

Posted on December 3, 2010 at 2:40 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 443

It's days like today I really miss walking up 6th Street to Gate 34.

Posted on December 3, 2010 at 5:14 PM by luke Highlight this comment 444

Great!!!!!! Twins are gonna give me 1 days notice for my relocation time,during my busiest work month..THANKS!!!!! Not too keen on doing this on my Iphone and no puter access during the weekday..THANKS AGAIN!!!!!

Posted on December 3, 2010 at 6:51 PM by Steve Highlight this comment 445

HaHa...It figures...I bich and 5 minutes later I get the email even though my rep had just said I would get it Monday an hour ago..All's good and I go the 7th @ 11:00..

Posted on December 3, 2010 at 7:51 PM by Steve Highlight this comment 446

The Relocation and Upgrade process for the 2011 season will take place from December 7th through December 16th, 2010. As a reminder, the entire relocation and upgrade process will take place online.
Interesting::

Relocation & Upgrade Information
There are four actions that can be performed through this process:

1. Retain existing seats
2. Retain existing seats and add up to four seats
3. Relocate or upgrade some or all of your existing seats
4. Relocate or upgrade some or all of your existing seats and add up to four seats

Posted on December 3, 2010 at 7:54 PM by Steve Highlight this comment 447

Let me get this straight. They just got done cutting back on the number of seats that scaplers (existing season ticket holders) could hold. Now during the relocation process they are allowing these same people to add 4 additional seats to there existing seats?

Am I missing something?

Most of us that bought season tickets bought what we wanted or needed. Wouldn't it be more fair to allow everyone to upgrade, then if there is still interest in adding additional tickets, it could be done at that time? After everyone upgraded? There are some serious advantages to being high on the priority list.

Posted on December 3, 2010 at 9:16 PM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 448

I believe if you want to add seats they must be worse than the seats you already have. I am pretty sure you won't be able to double down while improving seat location.

Posted on December 3, 2010 at 9:26 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 449

minn55441,

What you may be missing is what's really behind the public pronouncements about reigning in brokers.

The ticket reps know who the ticket brokers are, and they like them. There has been something of a wink-wink approach to it in the past, and as long as nobody got too crazy about it, the Twins just looked the other way.

I checked with a broker that I know a while back to see if the newly publicized policies had affected him at all. In short, they had not.

The Twins may be serious about trying to reign in the brokers, but the front line reps probably aren't as keen on it since it means lost sales.

It's just as possible that the whole rule change thing is just for publicity purposes. I really don't know which it is.

Posted on December 3, 2010 at 9:39 PM by Rick 450

That's the reason for my posting..I signed up for a relocation opportunity. I had no idea about the "adding" of more seats..I was kinda shocked..The seating chart is available Monday morning to view.I'll be interested what's up for grabs even though I won't be adding any.

Posted on December 3, 2010 at 10:28 PM by Steve Highlight this comment 451

I think one of the criteria for a Twins ticket rep job is a failure to make it in the used car sales business.

Posted on December 3, 2010 at 11:33 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 452

I'm not an STH, but I do have a clarification question.
What is the difference between "upgrade" and "relocate"?
i.e., you have Row 15, middle row seats in the Grandstand, and you get Row 8, aisle seats in the Grandstand? is that a relocation, or an upgrade? I'm guessing "relocate" is just getting different seats in the same price tier, and upgrade is moving from one price tier to another?

Posted on December 4, 2010 at 09:31 AM by luke Highlight this comment 453

Has anyone found out whether tickets released during the STH relocation process will then become available for others taking part in the process?
On the reining in of broker accounts, Rick's account of his discussion with a broker (local?) makes sense, especially if it's true that out of state addresses are an important factor in the decision to not renew an account.
It will be interesting to hear if more good seats are avalable than otherwise expected. If the reining in of broker accounts opens up seats for the relocation, then not only could early pickers improve, but some of them would presumably give up their current seats which could maybe become available for mid- and late pickers. That might be wishful thinking but at least intriguing.

Posted on December 4, 2010 at 5:40 PM by robin Highlight this comment 454

Here's the kicker: The broker I spoke with has (and has always had) an out-of-state address. He has been known to purchase large blocks of outfield seats (those which had been held and not needed for school groups and the like).

In that sense, he's always been doing the Twins a favor, in addition to making a profit.

But it's important to point out that, on more than one occasion, he gambled and lost. He told me a story about one sort of rainy weekday game that he had $3000 invested in such seats and lost it all.

But he was unphased. "I'll make it up on the weekend," he told me. (And he did.)

Posted on December 4, 2010 at 7:24 PM by Rick 455

I am considering relocation from section 306 row 7, to section 304 rows 2 to 6 (and no closer than about six seats from the aisle toward home.)

I don't mind the net's cable across the batter's box too much in 306, but would rather not have them. I also think it will be nice to be slightly closer to the foul line in 304. Does anyone not like 304?

Or maybe I should try for section 307 rows 2 to 7 because it looks better on the seating chart?

I guess I won't know what's possible until I log on Tuesday @ 2:58.

Posted on December 4, 2010 at 9:52 PM by Buzz Highlight this comment 456

Buzz, can't you monitor the situation Monday and Tuesday before you pick? In the original seat selection process we had a good idea of what would be available and could be prepared for 2nd and 3rd choices.

Posted on December 4, 2010 at 11:13 PM by robin Highlight this comment 457

The seats available will be viewable tonight at 12:00am...

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 08:11 AM by Steve Highlight this comment 458

Has any tried calling the phone number that they provided? I just assumed that no one would answer until Monday. I'm curious if our selection times are a window, ie 1:00pm to 1:15pm or if the listed means that we can make a selection at that time or anytime afterwards.

It may be the case that we don't see anything we like at our selectioon time, but then later in the day or even the following day something pops up that would be of interest. Also, as was mentioned earlier if we have two seats in our current location and then find 4 seats in a better location, are we able to upgrade and add the two additonal seats?

I thought I would call on Monday, after I take a look at the site and see what it looks like.

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 10:52 AM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 459

Again would love to see a screencap of those available seats.

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 11:04 AM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 460

I would think, like last time, that you can look beyond your window, up until the process ends. Hope so, as the notice was too short to take time off for some of us.

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 12:50 PM by robin Highlight this comment 461

the relocation site is up and running. If you have your account number and password, you can go in and take a look.

there are a lot more seats available than I thought.

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 1:19 PM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 462

minn55441,
Thanks...If that is what's available that would be incredible for people who signed up for relocation.I just looked and many GREAT seats are for the pickings.

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 2:00 PM by Steve Highlight this comment 463

Somebody grab a screen capture of the relocation image and I'm happy to post it here. (rick at this domain)

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 2:02 PM by Rick 464

I recall someone saying that in Row 1 of the 300 level they weren't protected from the rain. Does anybody know in the 300 level what is the first row you are protected from the rain? (I'll take the rain over the Metrodome any day.) Thanks

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 2:05 PM by Target Field Fan (aka Go Go Twins) Highlight this comment 465

Rick,
I need to zoom to section to see the available seats..Which section you want a screen capture from?

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 2:25 PM by Steve Highlight this comment 466

Hmm, I guess I misunderstood the level of detail available. Here's the overview:


Thanks, Luke.

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 3:39 PM by Rick 467

I don't think that the exact seats available are currently updated, as there are many sections with considerable numbers of seats shown as being available. Unless thousands of seats have suddenly become available because of restrictions placed on scalpers, I would be very surprised if everything currently shown as available stays that way when the process begins on Tuesday morning.

By the way, did anyone receive a notice that their access time is not Tuesday? My time is Tuesday afternoon and it seems as if everyone that has commented on this site has mentioned that they also have an access time on Tuesday. I know that the relocation will go on through the 16th, however does anyone have their initial access time on any of the days after the 7th?

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 3:54 PM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 468

I have the 9th, but have only had our sth for 4 years...

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 4:04 PM by tk Highlight this comment 469

I agree minn55441...No way all these seats are available..When I log in it seems that just way to many are up for grabs..It shows my seats in the blue as selected as it should but I'd rather think that it's just the model ready for action..My email did say that by tomorrow morning you could see what's available.

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 4:43 PM by Steve Highlight this comment 470

It sort of looks like that map is showing where season tickets have been sold? I would imagine it will get more detail as the process gets closer to actually starting.

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 5:21 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 471

"It sort of looks like that map is showing where season tickets have been sold? I would imagine it will get more detail as the process gets closer to actually starting."
It's detailed right now..The map posted is your 1st map..click a section and you get a seat by seat breakdown for any section when you are logged in.

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 5:38 PM by Steve Highlight this comment 472

No way...tons of availability for rows 1-8 and none for rows 9+. This will likely look a lot different before tomorrow.

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 5:49 PM by twinswschamps2010 Highlight this comment 473

"I have the 9th, but have only had sth for 4 years...." TK

TK - STH that are looking to relocate or upgrade to a full season start on the 7th, 40 game plan on the 9th. Are you a 40 game plan or looking to have a 40 game plan?

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 6:23 PM by Go Go Twins Highlight this comment 474

GGT,

I have both a 40-game and full season, where are you getting the information about when each selection begins?

I am going to call the hotline tomorrow, as it appears that we only got on the list to upgrade our 40-game and not the full season, even though I completed the application for both.

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 6:52 PM by TK Highlight this comment 475

TK
On the login and relocation web page is the information with the dates.
(Before you login you can see the info.)

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 8:07 PM by Go Go Twins Highlight this comment 476

Twinschamps2010 has it correct. When I log in with one of my two full season accounts it shows one pair of seats in blue (present location). And my other account, that I have started payment, in green (available). The available seats will be different come Tuesday.

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 8:19 PM by NotMendoza Highlight this comment 477

Buzz sent me some representative screen captures. These are detail views (section number at the top). It's interesting stuff, even for a non-STH.
























Posted on December 5, 2010 at 8:23 PM by Rick 478

Oooooohhh! Perfect!

Is anyone willing to compile a collection of all of TF's sections in such detail?

Those of us non-STHs, when presented with a particular ticket offer, would die for just such specific information on precise section/row/seat particulars.

Pretty, please?!?!

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 9:09 PM by schweady Highlight this comment 479

Yeah, I was trying to think of just how to ask the same thing... Sure would be handy.

(It would make it especially easy to mark the bad areas that I've discovered. For example, I'm assuming that everyone knows they should stay away from aisle seats in rows 9 and 10 of all View Level sections, right?)

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 9:12 PM by Rick 480

Was I wrong in saying we could probably pick after our designated time? The wording I just read sounds like it has to be during the time. Maybe imprecise wording?
So seats we own are blue on our own login but red in the screen shots above? I was surprised to see mine red in the above screen shots and surrounded by green. So I still don't get the significance of green and red in this context.

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 9:16 PM by robin Highlight this comment 481

Robin - could it be that all available seats as well as all seats where the people put in to improve are shown in red? If not, I am really surprised to see that many great seats become available. Can anyone else verify that put in for relocation have their seats listed in red on the above screen shots?

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 9:32 PM by clublevelfan Highlight this comment 482

Just how much is Jayson Werth worth? WTF are the Nats thinking?

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 10:45 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 483

In the new relocation model, what was the "skyline deck" last year is currently labeled as Legends club S, T, U and V.

I had not heard mention of converting those sections over to the legends club. There is still a notch between those sections and the traditional legends club and they also do not have access to the other legends club amenities. I wonder if that is something that is in the works for future renovations?

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 10:51 PM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 484

If it's true, that's a very sensible change. The Legends Club and atriums always seemed under-utilized to me, even when they sold the drink rail seats (a bad idea which, I think, was also a failure).

The only problem might be the need to replace those seats (which are not padded or wood-backed, and seem a little bit skinnier). I suppose you could also just create another price level to solve that problem.

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 10:59 PM by Rick 485

Forgot to say that when it rains it's a different story. (Cold didn't seem to drive people in quite as much.)

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 11:01 PM by Rick 486

GGT,

I was asking about where you received the dates about Full-Season starting on December 7 and those with 40-games starting on Dec. 9?

I do not see that anywhere in the published online reading anywhere.

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 11:04 PM by TK Highlight this comment 487

Please disregard, I found it. It has definitely been a long weekend...

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 11:06 PM by TK Highlight this comment 488

Thanks, clublevel, I was thinking somewhat along those lines, but am used to green meaning available.
Converting SLD to club level would be quite a move. I wonder if it's an error. When I tried clicking on club levels I got nothing. I think they can only be taken by separate transactions, purchasing memberships from existing owners. Though if a current owner doesn't pay for their tickets, or are canceled by Twins, maybe this would be one way of filling them.

Posted on December 5, 2010 at 11:35 PM by robin Highlight this comment 489

Question for anyone that can view relocation seats for 20 or 40-game plans: are there more rows available in 304 other than the first two rows?

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 12:34 AM by Buzz Highlight this comment 490

Werth is not worth that much! WTF Nats indeed

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 12:48 AM by The Sooj Highlight this comment 491

Glad I found this site. Tons of great info.

I also noticed way too many good seats available in the relocation tool. Also, I can't see the Legend's club at all.

I've only had ST for the past year. My time is at 5:45, anyone have a point of reference for me to compare? I'm assuming they will open it up around 8:00 in the morning?

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 02:27 AM by bp Highlight this comment 492

Legends Club is probably not available through the relocation process. Skyline Deck is sometimes categorized as "club level", presumably because of it's physical location, as opposed to actual club amenities, membership rights, etc. Are they even available on STH relocation? I thought they were part of individual and group sales only.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 04:27 AM by robin Highlight this comment 493

Just checked it out and they do label skyline deck as "legend club". My mistake, maybe theirs too? But I can't get it to show any seats available on the club level, so I am probably right about those not being available through the relocation process.
Looking further, the idea that red is available makes sense, since there are large blocks of red seats at tops of some sections, and more green than red in first rows of sections.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 05:04 AM by robin Highlight this comment 494

Yeha, I've got Legend's Club and was hoping to move closer, but maybe that's just not an option with the PSL's.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 07:57 AM by bp Highlight this comment 495

I'm giving this relo process about a 50/50 chance of working correctly tomorrow...

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 08:40 AM by twinswschamps2011 (aka twinswschamps2010) Highlight this comment 496

When I spoke with a Twins rep about LC last month he said there are some PSL holders that just didn't want to keep them, and turned them back to the Twins. They are apparently going to allow existing LC holders the opportunity to buy additional seats, and I think he said they will re-sell those themselves later.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 08:48 AM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 497

One losing season and the Twins will be wanting that broker business back. I think the fact that up to 4 addl seats are being allowed...I'm not quite sure there is a stampede for these tickets like they thought when they started cutting off brokers. Are there a lot of non-STH on this board just dying to get in for full season tickets? New stadium effects can last for about 3 years if the team is good...less than that if the team sucks. TCF already fell apart for the Gophers in year #2.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 08:56 AM by twinswschamps2011 (aka twinswschamps2010) Highlight this comment 498

Wow don't get to log in till 15th! I would say my chances are perhaps slim to none to move down about 3 sections given the fact that those logging in earlier can add additional seats LOL! Oh well I can live with my current location anyways! Should be interesting to see how this shakes out.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 09:33 AM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 499

Twink I'm not so sure that people can improve and double down. I'd check with the rep, or I'm sure we'll have comments from those selecting here in the next couple of days that will confirm that.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 10:13 AM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 500

Green, red, mean nothing now. Skyline Deck will stay as is.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 12:46 PM by robin Highlight this comment 501

I just got off the phone with the VIP Season ticketholder hotline. Here are the basics.
1)We can log in to the relocation at any time during the day tomorrow.
2)We can only make changes beginning at our designated time and from that point on until the end of the day.
3)The current seats listed as available on the site are not accurate, it is just a test program that has been loaded. the actual availability will not be visible until the process starts tomorrow at 9:00am.
4)It is possible to both upgrade and add additional tickets.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 12:50 PM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 502

Thanks for the clarification minn.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 12:54 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 503

minn55441,

That makes perfect sense. I could not believe how many "available" seats were in Section 115.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 1:03 PM by tk Highlight this comment 504

So what percentage of season ticket holders registered to upgrade of add seats do you think? 50%? Be curious to find out!

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 1:55 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 505

Here's just a general call to all STH folks:

If you think of it, please take a screen cap of any section you check out and send them to me (rick at this domain). We'll try to assemble as much of a detailed map of the seating bowl as possible.

(This has been something of a Holy Grail since last spring...)

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 2:14 PM by Rick 506

Holy Grail indeed, Rick.

It matters not what color the seats show up (although that would be interesting, too, once the real thing is made available to you STHs). It would just be very cool for this site to have a comprehensive visual database built displaying "rows-in-each-section" and "seats-in-each-row"...


Posted on December 6, 2010 at 2:50 PM by schweady Highlight this comment 507

This is starting to come together!

TK has graciously volunteered to get the Skyline View and Field View sections. If we have a few people each willing to do an area like that, it should be no big deal for anybody.

And, for clarity, just a raw screen capture is fine. No need to crop or resize or anything. I'll take care of all of that later.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 3:01 PM by Rick 508

Ni.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 3:01 PM by Rick 509

The Twins posted a photo showing them getting the scaffolding in place for the RF scoreboard. Also, there is a wreath hung on the batters eye. Nice!

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 3:08 PM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 510

Just a reminder for those who are interested.

Open House for The Interchange project

Come learn more about the Interchange project and share your comments with us. You are invited to join us to view project materials and provide feedback on project purpose and need, vision and goals, data collected and preliminary concepts.

Date/Time: December 7th from 4-7 pm. Brief presentation at 4:30 pm and 6:15 pm.

NEW location: Target Field, Suite 300 Minnesota Ballpark Authority Tour Theatre, 1 Twins Way, Minneapolis, MN 55403.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 4:29 PM by Jeff Highlight this comment 511

The system of available seats appears to have been updated.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 4:35 PM by tk Highlight this comment 512

So, the term "good seats still available" apparently has lots of clout for TF next season?? I'm amazed at how many CC seats are available. I would have thought those would be first to go.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 4:58 PM by luke Highlight this comment 513

Thanks for the tip TK.

I think this is a little closer to what we all expected. If everyone just moved up a couple of rows or down a section or two, I think everyone that had an interest would be able to move. With the ability to just add additional seats, I have a feeling everying will get scooped up pretty quickly and most of us will be unable to make a change. The sections that do have availiblity, only have 6 to 8 seats on average.

Good luck to everyone tomorrow.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 5:06 PM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 514

they have indeed been updated. skyline 325 row 2, a pair for someone who can get them. No Luke, no CC.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 5:07 PM by robin Highlight this comment 515

Wow...I guess demand is pretty stiff. So much for my dream of adding 4 more field view seats. I don't think the seven total field view seats are gonna hold out til 3:45 p.m. It is interesting to see that there appears to have been some dumping of upper seats behind home plate. Maybe $30/seat was too much for the value of the seat...i.e $11 and $13 seats that are somewhat similar?

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 5:14 PM by twinswschamps2011 (aka twinswschamps2010) Highlight this comment 516

...so, that overview pic that Rick posted yesterday afternoon (post #467) is now updated/accurate? 'twould be intersting to see a shot of that... anyone...?

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 5:24 PM by schweady Highlight this comment 517

But help yourselves to a pair of dugout box seats in Section 5.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 5:25 PM by robin Highlight this comment 518

How do you get to the relocation page?
The Twins have no direct link and I can't find it to save my life. Guess I'll have top stay put.......
Thanks

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 6:07 PM by j2k Highlight this comment 519

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 6:24 PM by bp Highlight this comment 520

Updated view


Posted on December 6, 2010 at 6:32 PM by bp Highlight this comment 521

Updated view


Posted on December 6, 2010 at 6:33 PM by bp Highlight this comment 522

Wow, they updated the seats and not much available. Oh well. I tried posting an image, we'll see if it posts. I'm not very internet literate.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 6:35 PM by bp Highlight this comment 523

Well,,The relocation page is way different now..WOW..Not much out there..I'm wondering if it's worth taking off work for an hour to even do it...I was gonna maybe slide over to 110 from my 109's or move down just a few rows..No way Jose.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 6:36 PM by Steve Highlight this comment 524

Yeah, ticket reps weren't kidding. I'll be surprised if anything is available by the my time at 5:45.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 6:38 PM by bp Highlight this comment 525

(I'm assuming) You can see where some ticket brokers cancelled as there are a few places where there are 10 seats in a row that are available (but not very many).

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 6:41 PM by bp Highlight this comment 526

Is the outer edge of HPB available? Would be interested in how far to the edges or back they went first time around.

Posted on December 6, 2010 at 7:01 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 527

Well, it is interesting to me as well that there is so much availability in the home plate terrace sections. One thing that is holding those back is the insistence on full season packages...no partials in those sections. That is where I wanted to sit, but I don't want 81 games.

Of course, that view could just be 4 consecutive tickets in one row for each section. Thanks to all for posting their experiences. I sat tight this year, but I want to know how it goes and what the chances are for future years.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 08:06 AM by Lincster Highlight this comment 528

Most home plate terrace sections have about 1 row out of seats available (spread out over the whole section) out of the 4 or 5 rows in the section.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 08:23 AM by BP Highlight this comment 529

I hate to volunteer the "S" word...but buyers that don't want to spring for full season tickets should keep an eye on Stubhub right now. You can get view level seats for marquee games (Brewers, White Sox, Padres, Dodgers) for $30 or even less. Given these types of games ran up over $50 last year makes this price relatively attractive if you can't get your hands on cheap full-seasons. Keep in mind that if you were able to get single game tickets through the Twins for these games (which you probably won't as they will be gobbled up by STH during the presale), they would cost about $20 each with fees. It's a matter of getting mildly bent over versus severely bent over. Of course, I'm assuming the Twins will be good in 2011. If they start off 10-20, all tickets will get cheaper quickly.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 08:35 AM by twinswschamps2011 (aka twinswschamps2010) Highlight this comment 530

Not to mention that some of the less desireable games (Royals, Indians, etc) are basically going for close to face value.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 08:36 AM by twinswschamps2011 (aka twinswschamps2010) Highlight this comment 531

Section 225 is green for a reason...some of the seats don't have views of home plate because of the wheel chair seating next to it and it is not turned towards second as much as other sections on the level. 224 or 226 are better.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 08:38 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 532

Wow, there is hardly anything available on the Skyline view sections. I wonder if you click the differnet 20 game plans if that changes. Only got 8 more days to see. LOL! I would say my odds of moving over to 323 in rows 2-7 about zippo! Oh well!

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 09:02 AM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 533

Interesting that this map is showing so much available in HPB as well. Especially right behind the plate.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 09:07 AM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 534

The map has been in a continual state of change since they first gave us access to it. But when I logged on today (although my re-location app't. isn't until Dec. 9), there is a comment at the bottom of the overhead view saying that you will not see what ticket inventory is actually available until your app't. time. So whatever we see now is probably not totally accurate.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 09:34 AM by EagleEyes Highlight this comment 535

I go later on today. I can see purple seats where presumably people are reserving seats, so I think on my end at least, it is live.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 10:17 AM by BP Highlight this comment 536

In large part, this is a game of musical chairs. My seats show up as unavailable, until I select other seats, at which time mine become available for the STH following me in this process. A bigger problem for those fo us picking later this week or next is that STH can also ADD seats, so they can keep their own and snatch up available inventory.

By the time we partial package owners pick, there really won't be much left. 25,000 FSE could go to 30,000. And most if not all of the cheap seats will be gone.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 10:28 AM by BR Highlight this comment 537

Thanks to everyone who has started doing screen captures. Here are the sections still needed:

1-6
7-10
11-17
101-103
104-107
108-120
121-124
125-127
128-131
132-135
136-138
139-141
208-222
229-234
235-236
237-240
308-322
329-334

I'll post periodic updates. Just let me know which one you're going to do so we don't duplicate each other's efforts. Thanks!

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 11:35 AM by Rick 538

Is the Bud Deck visible on the seat relocator?

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 11:37 AM by Rick 539

It seems as though there should be a way to have a chance of upgrading/relocating what people have BEFORE folks can start grabbing up extra seats - a two step process I suppose. Is this not catering to the scalpers?

My e-mail today says to get ready because my time is "only two days away", and elsewhere that "my time" begins at xx:xx 12/14 (20 game plan) - I guess they must have given away ALL their calendars!

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 11:42 AM by Ben Highlight this comment 540

Ben,

I think that is there standard line that the times for 40/20 game selection opens 12/9 for your package, even though you do not select until later on.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 11:47 AM by tk Highlight this comment 541

I don't think the partial packages are open to purchase in this round. The upper rows of a lot of the lower level sections along the base lines are completely red, as are most upper level and outfield seats. I think they are planning on opening them up when people with those plans are going. This is speculation on my part.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 12:09 PM by BP Highlight this comment 542

In other words, there should still be a decent number of tickets in those areas even though you can't see it now.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 12:10 PM by BP Highlight this comment 543

Hmm. Something Bad has happened... We've apparently traveled back in time.

I will check on this.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 4:21 PM by Rick 544

And I think the relocation site is down?

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 4:47 PM by Steve Highlight this comment 545

Looks like you can no longer go into view until 1 hr before your selection time now!

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 4:56 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 546

man, some of you really need to find a new hobby or something else to talk about.

rick - have a heart, show some mercy and throw these guys a bone. give them a quick, hastily put together new post to get their minds on something else.

sheesh!

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 6:35 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 547

Wha? I go fishing for a few hours and a day and a half of posts disappear? I was going to show a buddy the more accurate 'seats available' overview from a few post back, and it's gone. People not playing nice?

So, Rick, how are you getting enough section seating detail screen grab maps from our STH friends for a comprehensive collection?

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 7:20 PM by schweady Highlight this comment 548

Anyone have any idea when single game tickets will go on sale?

When did they go on sale last year?

Thanks in advance...

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 7:36 PM by trosy29 Highlight this comment 549

Last I heard (in mid-October)...single game tickets are scheduled to go on sale on Saturday, March 19...not sure if these are still the plans or not.

Last year, they went on sale on Saturday, March 13.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 9:37 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 550

The hot tub time machine has brought us back to the present. (In other words, I believe that all the comments have been fully restored.)

Don't know what that was, but it sure was UGLY.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 9:37 PM by Rick 551

Okay, we're back, I guess... And here I thought that it might have been a blackout related to folks being a bit overzealous about their current hobbies and some subsequent whining about it. Guess not...

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 9:48 PM by schweady Highlight this comment 552

Just curious: still a gap from noon to four?
Anybody get a good deal from relocation?

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 9:50 PM by robin Highlight this comment 553

...So, I'll ask again, now that you're not so busy winding clocks:

Rick, are you getting enough section seating detail screen grab maps from our STH friends for a comprehensive collection?

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 9:51 PM by schweady Highlight this comment 554

Looks like they ate up those Home Plate Terrace seats pretty good. The few half decent dugout box seats gone. Section 121 is almost sold out; someone right now is holding 2 of a set of 3. I wonder if they will be allowed to do that. It would leave only singles. They will be disappointed if they go to confirm their sale and then are told they can't do it, as happened to some in initial season ticket selection.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 10:05 PM by robin Highlight this comment 555

Something Bud has happened. The Twins are contracted and the Saints will move in as a farm team of the Brewers. We will be allowed to keep our seats however. Same prices.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 10:09 PM by robin Highlight this comment 556

That could have been a better experience. You would think they could buy more bandwidth or something for these peak traffic times. Oh well, at least I got to think about baseball in December. Opening day can't come soon enough.

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 11:19 PM by bp Highlight this comment 557

I'm still looking for the sections I listed earlier (comment 538). I think it would only take a half dozen folks each taking three of those lines up there. (Obviously, I'd happily do this myself, but I'm not an STH and can't access the pages in question.)

Posted on December 7, 2010 at 11:42 PM by Rick 558

Is there a certain time of day the relocation process stops? I couldn't access it at work, so I tried when I got home at 2 am and I could not get on. I guess I am going to have to try early in the morning.

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 03:14 AM by duffman Highlight this comment 559

Are there instructions on an earlier post? Or is it just something any computer-literate person knows how to do? And there is no legal issue I suppose?
There are times I can't get access to the site at all, for example late afternoon to mid-evening. But I did later so it doesn't seem related to when relocation takes place.

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 04:46 AM by robin Highlight this comment 560

The system seems to be very kludgey. I couldn't get in yesterday at my "time" so I tried again in the evening. Still couldn't get in. Last night later on I tried and got in but there was ZERO availability in the areas I wanted to potentially upgrade to. This morning I tried logging in to see what was out there and got a message that it was more than 1 hour prior to my time so I couldn't get in yet. Huh? My time was yesterday!

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 07:49 AM by Syzygy00 Highlight this comment 561

Still never got on...now it's not letting me on since I'm more than one hour from my login time, even though my login was yesterday. I gave it a 50/50 shot, and I'd say it was pretty much a bust. Kind of unnecessary too. The Twins are more phone sales, etc. types, and they're trying to go high-tech on us when there are literally a few seats here and there available. This system would work better when a team has thousands of seats available. The Twins just need to worry about customer satisfaction. But, it was neat seeing the maps before it counted. Sorry I can't fill in the blanks for you, Rick.

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 08:12 AM by twinswschamps2011 (aka twinswschamps2010) Highlight this comment 562

OK this is strange. Got an e-mail from the twins @ 4:00am saying my relocation process is 2 days away. Then further down it says my time is Dec 15th.. Wow!!!!!! LOL! Looks like a meltdown???

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 08:40 AM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 563

Yesterday afternoon the relocation site was not being nice (had seats in cart and message said seats were not able to be purchased). The VIP line did not answer my calls or return my message. Thankfully my season ticket representative was able to work some magic. I relocated from first base side row 1 in home plate terrace to 3rd base side row 2 in home plate terrace. Now I will be able to see Gardy fume in the Twins dugout, check the growth of the topiaries, and save some $. Hopefully the sun will be manageable on 3rd base infield. I noticed there were more seats along 3rd base side in field box than on 1st base side field box. Also, after relocating I was not able to access the site. It might be that the site will be accessible when your selection time is within one hour. Overall I found the experience to be exciting and challenging (kind of like when I met my wife to be).

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 08:48 AM by NotMendoza Highlight this comment 564

Robin my group was able to go from HPB to Dugout Box. A pair of seats that was open before things started was still open mid day. Surprised the hell out of me. Anyone know how unbearable the sun will be on the 3rd base side Dugout box? I was sort of glad to be in shade for day games by summer time.

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 08:55 AM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 565

So for those that got in to relocate did there appear to be lots of open seats or not? I see I just got another e-mail for free twinsfeast tickets!

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 09:11 AM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 566

Congratulations JC. If it was 16 or 17 you got, they had front rows available when I originally picked my seats. Because of the wheelchair section in front, they weren't actually front row on the field. If you got 14 or 15 you did even better. A lot depends on the individual's sun tolerance. Except for a few especially hot days, I preferred that side. It seems most prefer the shade side.

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 09:21 AM by robin Highlight this comment 567

We got 15...

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 09:34 AM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 568

I will take the sun! Early and late in the year makes a huge difference from sun to shade! I only get about 7 day games on my 20 game package anyways!

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 09:36 AM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 569

To get your "free" Twinsfest tix you need to fill out a form with all the usual info (can you say "mailing list") including phone # and CC card #. WTF?!?! Nothing about your first born yet.

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 10:54 AM by Ben Highlight this comment 570

I sounds as if I had the opposite experience from the rest of you. My access time was 2:40, at 2:30 the site went down. I called, knowing at the time that I had 2 options I was willing to upgrade too. The person that answered the VIP line said it would just be down for a minute and that I could get right back into the site.

This turned out not to be true. I took a late lunch specifically because of my relocation time. The site was sitll not up and running at 3:00pm when I had to return to work. Needless to say, at 6:30pm when I got back into the site, nothing of interest was still available. I did send an e-mail and left a voicemail prior to 3:00pm asking for what they could do for me, but I never receieved a response. I was very excited about upgrading and as I mentioned had two locations picked out. Very, Very frustrated with the process. It seeemed to work fine up until it was time for me to make a selection.

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 11:30 AM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 571

Yep never been to Twinsfeast and doubt I will make it to the humpty dump even if tickets are free!

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 11:34 AM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 572

Just got off the phone with the Twins, it seems once again they under estimated the number of fans attempting to get onto the site. The sales rep said they would contact me in January about relocation/upgrade to a full season. I know they technically out sourced this to anther company but between this fiasco and that damned "virtual waiting room" the Twins need to find some new IT people.

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 11:52 AM by Duffman Highlight this comment 573

Well looks like you can not view whats available till 1 hour prior to your time now. Intersting that I got the e-mail saying I'm 2 days out when my other e-mail says not till the 15th? LOL!

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 12:00 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 574

Duff you're right. I guess money's sort of tight in Twinsville these days...oh wait...

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 12:04 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 575

I was being too generous with the 50/50 chance estimation of it working the other day...The Twins are at their best with pencils, paper, voice mails and phones/faxes. It takes me days to get movement on particular issues...this just seemed way too high-tech for them. It did provide some increased traffic here during the off-season, though.

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 12:05 PM by twinswschamps2011 (aka twinswschamps2010) Highlight this comment 576

Paulie K just re-signed with the Sox...the AL Central is shaping up to be a dogfight next year. The Tigers will be tough with V-Mart, and now the Sox adding Dunn. Hopefully, Bill has more up his sleeve than Tish...

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 2:03 PM by twinswschamps2011 (aka twinswschamps2010) Highlight this comment 577

...or make that Nish... :)

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 2:04 PM by twinswschamps2011 (aka twinswschamps2010) Highlight this comment 578

I get sick of Twins fans saying the "Twins are cheap and don't spend enough"....Hate to say it but the Twins are handcuffed with some big contracts in Joe Mauer, Joe Nathan, Michael Cuddyer, and Justin Morneau.

They are more than likely going to have a top-10 payroll primarily due to those four players alone.

Will be interesting what happens with the Hardy to Baltimore trade. Also, Pavano will be making some serious cash too if he in fact re-signs as is being rumored.

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 2:22 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 579

Mike,

I have not heard much about right-hander Brett Jacobsen, but I like his stats...

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 3:15 PM by tk Highlight this comment 580

*Jacobson

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 3:16 PM by tk Highlight this comment 581

Yes, Twinschamps -- we are getting not ONE but TWO minor leaguers from Baltimore for Hardy. Look out Yankees!

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 3:20 PM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 582

Those Yankees will never see what's coming with those minor leaguers lobbing it over the plate.

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 4:01 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 583

Rick - I have and will zip up all the Home Plate Box sections from the relocation.

The Twins sent an email this morning, apologizing about the system overload - looks like the system crashed just after I got out.

For those interested, there is/was very little Home Plate Box inventory as of 11 am yesterday, other than in the top rows. Also looks like the Twins are allowing orphan seats, unlike during the relocation process, as some of the open three's were being selected as pairs. The best seats I saw open was 120 row 5, which, although lower than mine, I didn't really consider an upgrade. Most other locations were at least row 14, some in the top couple rows.

Seats that were released did not seem to be available for selection, which is consistent with how most teams seem to manage inventory, at least in the more desirable sections. I presume those released this year will be available next year and so on. Of course, with people now being told to contact their rep if they had problems yesterday, who knows what will happen. As someone else mentioned, for the partial plan relocations starting tomorrow, STHs are limited to signing on an hour ahead of their start time.

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 6:12 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 584

Here is the text of the email from this morning:

"As you are aware, we experienced issues with our Relocation & Upgrade website yesterday afternoon. We sincerely apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused you. It was our hope that this process would have given our valued Season Ticket Holders the opportunity to seamlessly make any seat changes for the 2011 season.

If for whatever reason you were unable to successfully access the Relocation & Upgrade website, and/or complete your online transaction, we invite you contact your Twins Account Representative or call the VIP Season Ticket Holder Phone Line at (612)370-4575. At that time we ask that you convey to us what your intentions are for relocating or upgrading your seats for the 2011 season. We promise to contact you prior to the sale of any full season tickets to new customers and provide you with any options that may fit your needs should they exist.

While we are aware that this solution may not fully rectify your experience from yesterday, it is our hope that you know that we will do everything in our power to show our commitment to giving the best customer service possible to our most valued fans...our Season Ticket Holders.

Again, we apologize for this technical issue and we appreciate your continued support of Twins Baseball.

Regards,

Your Twins Ticket Sales & Service Team"

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 6:17 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 585

jfh --

Thanks for taking the time to do some section seating detail screenshots. I understand that some folks may not be inclined to take some of their limited time to do it prior to making their selections, and then perhaps they are locked out after completion (??). If it were at all possible for someone to trust me with their login and password (yeah, I know: and their SSN and mother's maiden name... hee hee) I would do it myself and quit bothering folks who are just trying to get their business done.

It has the potential of a very cool addition to this site's resource set. Thanks once again for contributing to that.

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 7:07 PM by schweady Highlight this comment 586

Once you finalized your selection (or kept your existing seats) the availability maps were selectable, but no longer displayed. I had actually forgotten that Rick wanted to do this project or would have tried to get more sections other than the Home Plate Box area and a couple others.

Posted on December 8, 2010 at 8:36 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 587

If it's been mentioned before, I'm sorry. But Charley "the God of sportswriting" Walters said this morning in the Pioneer Press:
"Pssst: Don’t be surprised if Twins free-agent reliever Jesse Crain ends up with the Colorado Rockies."

Amen to that brother. Now, maybe we'll finally break past the Central Division Series.

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 07:01 AM by luke Highlight this comment 588

I continue receiving screen captures, and really appreciate it -- especially given how difficult the system has been. Whoever vetted the vendor the Twins are using should be taken out to the woodshed, to say the least.

Here's a quick update on section screen captures still needed:

1-5
7-17
101-106
122-128
130-141
229-240
308-322
329-334

Every capture helps. And there's no need to edit or crop them. I'll take care of that. Thanks!

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 10:04 AM by Rick 589

luke - Thanks for the thought, but I'd prefer Mr. Crain stays away from the Rockies ... :)

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 10:17 AM by jfh Highlight this comment 590

One more thing: As I said before, I'm happy to do this myself, but I'm not an STH.

It occurred to me that there might be someone out there who was issued a login and password but has no interest in changing their seats.

I could use that info to finish this little project. If you are such a person, drop me a line (rick at this domain).

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 10:18 AM by Rick 591

Rick - do you care how recent the screen shots are? I have some of the ones you are looking for from the TF relocation. Are those good enough?

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 10:19 AM by jfh Highlight this comment 592

Because I'm just looking for seat configuration (and don't care at all whether seats are available or not), it doesn't matter how old they are. I'll take whatever you got!

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 10:34 AM by Rick 593

Twins must be having more volume problems with the system - login for partial plan holders is now limited to 1/2 hour within appointment time. (Was first "all day", then "1 hour", now "1/2 hour").

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 10:45 AM by jfh Highlight this comment 594

Rick - I will work on getting some of the sections you still need today. I believe I have all the dugout box sections from last year.

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 10:47 AM by jfh Highlight this comment 595

A quick question about Spring Training. Do you need tickets for practice time? If yes, are they sold the same way game tickets? Do they sell out quickly? Considering making a first trip down this year to Spring Training.

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 12:01 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 596

Rick, if my TF section count total is correct (151), we are half-way there.

Doubtful that a lot was done that would make images from a year ago horribly outdated. Handicapped seating configurations, perhaps?

If I can help with the screenshot project, drop me a line.

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 12:04 PM by schweady Highlight this comment 597

I'm not a huge JJ Hardy guy, but I'm not getting the thinking of letting him go for 2 minor leaguers, and then throw what will be more money at an unproven and same-aged Nish. Was this a way to get Brendan Harris off the books?

Also, it seems when I looked a few months back, that with the acquisitions of Dunn and V-Mart, the payroll of the Tigers should be around $125-$130 million, and the Sox should have a payroll of about $120 million. I don't see any justification for the Tigers to have a higher payroll than we do....the Sox, maybe, but not the Tigers.

I'm actually pretty high on our starting pitching. I think Blackburn has huge potential, as does Duensing. I think Smith would be wise to lock up Pavano...and give the fifth spot to Slowey until a starter emerges from the minors. Move Baker to the bullpen, to join the hodge-podge in there. The bullpen is the easiest fix in baseball.

The Red Sox adding 2 of the top 10 players in the game certainly makes a World Series trip that much harder for us.

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 12:13 PM by twinswschamps2011 (aka twinswschamps2010) Highlight this comment 598

Rick - got the remaining sections you listed except the Dugout Box sections. I may have some of those from last year. Will package/send today.

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 12:39 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 599

Anyone know what sections in Field View have two seats for 40-games available?

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 12:46 PM by Buzz Highlight this comment 600

Buzz - earlier today there were some in sections 125 (row 17) and 126 (row 9). It's really going to depend on when your slot is though.

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 1:07 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 601

TK and jfh have come through big! Here's all that's remaining for screen captures:

1-5
7-17
130-141

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 1:20 PM by Rick 602

Yep I'm sure that baby is gonna look alot different on Dec 15 when I log in! LOL!

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 1:41 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 603

Getting very close now! All I'm missing are:

- Legends Club/Skyline Deck sections (A-V, forgot to list those earlier)

- Dugout Box/Champions Club (1-17, which are apparently sold out and not viewable)

- Bud Deck (328, which may not be on the selector at all)

If anybody has these, please send them along.

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 2:15 PM by Rick 604

Helpful advice from jfh:

"you can get into a sold out section by clicking on one of the sections that is orange and then just use forward or back to get there."

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 2:18 PM by Rick 605

jfh is right about moving side to side to view sold out sections. But you first have to be able to access a view-able section at that comparable level in order to start going side-to-side. And there isn't anywhere to access a section that can get you to Sec. 1-17. Also, the Bud Party Deck does not show up at all.

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 2:43 PM by EagleEyes Highlight this comment 606

Same issue with the Legends Club and Skyline Deck. If there isn't a view-able section (which there is not in these areas), you can't get access to the detailed view of any of those sections.

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 2:46 PM by EagleEyes Highlight this comment 607

Bud Deck is not selectable on any map I've seen.

Rick - I just sent the others I had from last year (a couple Dugout Box and LC sections). I can no longer log in to the full-season map with my password from the other day, so that's probably it. Also, 130-141 should be in the zip file.

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 4:20 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 608

Clarification re posts 600 and 601. Sections 125 and 126 are Field Box, not Field View, which Buzz was asking about. I think there was very limited availability there or their opposite field equivalent, the Skyline View.

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 4:26 PM by robin Highlight this comment 609

So you guys saying there is nothing available to even view in the skyline deck sections? Ouch!

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 4:27 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 610

I don't think any will be left today, Field Box or View, maybe a single. Does 40 game plan continue tomorrow? I wonder if the seats being replaced will show up for the 20 game plans, and if any are currently being reserved for 20 game plans.

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 4:37 PM by robin Highlight this comment 611

Skyline Deck is not sold as season tickets.

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 4:38 PM by robin Highlight this comment 612

JC: No tickets are required to watch the Twins practice/workout at their Spring Training complex in Fort Myers. You park in the lot (free and $5 on gamedays) and have access to the entire minor league complex. You'll only need tickets to get into the actual stadium. There are usually a few tailgates going on including Joe's family near the front in his black Mauer Chevrolet. Arrive early on game days as the parking is a nightmare (run by all the elderly retirees and it is a complete clusterf&ck close to game time).

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 4:41 PM by Max Highlight this comment 613

Skyline View might show up for 20 game plans.

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 4:46 PM by robin Highlight this comment 614

robin - thanks for the correction re: Field Box vs. Field View.

Regarding relocation times - this is what was posted regarding dates:

"Relocations and upgrades begin on Tuesday, December 7th for accounts interested in Full season tickets, on Thursday, December 9th for accounts interested in 40 game packages and on Tuesday, December 14th for accounts interested in 20 game packages."

Attempting to log on now with a password that was valid for Tuesday or today results in an error.

Posted on December 9, 2010 at 6:34 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 615

Thanks Max, that's helpful.

Posted on December 10, 2010 at 11:17 AM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 616

Anybody able to see what there was available for sec 323-326 Skyline View? I got a feeling it will be slim pickins come the 15th?

Posted on December 10, 2010 at 12:17 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 617

TwinkFan,

It is tough to say, I was only able to see Full Season and 40-game packages in that area. I am assuming you are a 20-game package, so you may have better luck, but there was not much for full-season; 40-game A/B plans.

Posted on December 10, 2010 at 1:12 PM by tk Highlight this comment 618

Thanks TK will find out I guess in 5 days!

Posted on December 10, 2010 at 3:26 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 619

The "guaranteed giveaway" scam is up to $58 (from $53) this year. Then, of course, they tack on another $3 at the end as a "convenience fee" - is there some reason they can't just be up-front?

Posted on December 10, 2010 at 6:17 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 620

I just don't understand the appeal of a package of stadium give-aways.

Posted on December 10, 2010 at 6:25 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 621

What happened to the "old met stadium" site? I'm getting access forbidden message. Would like to look at some of the old pics, etc.

Posted on December 10, 2010 at 9:42 PM by Ted Highlight this comment 622

All of my sites got moved to a new server this week after some sort of major crash (the second in the past 10 days). I'm still discovering things like this.

Keep trying. It will be back...

Posted on December 10, 2010 at 10:01 PM by Rick 623

Twinkfan 20s. I wasn't able to get in, but there was a mention of heavy usage. Just going by what I saw earlier, it doesn't look good, but I'm not sure what is happening with the tickets released when somebody relocates. Maybe when people finished their 40 game maneuverings Friday (or Monday?) there will be more choices than were apparent last week. It would seem that during the 20 game process (if tickets released are in fact made available same day) you might do alright even with a later spot.

Posted on December 11, 2010 at 07:41 AM by robin Highlight this comment 624

Poor TF. At this rate, by April it'll become the world's largest swimming pool. Days like this I wish webcam 1 was still working...

Posted on December 11, 2010 at 9:43 PM by luke Highlight this comment 625

After making the mistake of trying to drive today (and getting stuck several times in an unplowed parking lot, and twice on the road!), it's nice to come to this site and dream of baseball. :-)

Stay warm, everyone!

Posted on December 11, 2010 at 10:17 PM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 626

Much agreed F_T_K. Just about six weeks til TwinsFest, then we can REALLY start to think baseball.

Posted on December 11, 2010 at 10:32 PM by luke Highlight this comment 627

I went on the 2 o'clock TF tour today. Getting there and back on bus and train was an adventure, but people were talkative and friendly. The tour was great.  It was me and a couple from Rochester guided by Dick and Paul.  The guides were very informed and a lot of fun.  The slow pace of the day made seem natural for it to last two hours and fifteen minutes (don't expect it to be as long on a normal day). 

Click name for a 20-second look at the sleepy field all tucked in for the season. 

Don't worry Luke, the layer of fine rock and sand over the water collection drains and heaters will help the grass be green and safe for April. The only problems they had with pools of water were by the ramps to the Champion's Club.  They put in wider drains, but the holes are still small and may get clogged easily by a wrapper or something. 

Posted on December 11, 2010 at 11:05 PM by Buzz Highlight this comment 628

Good to know Buzz.
Sounds like Humpty Dumpty has taken a huge fall in the meantime.

Posted on December 12, 2010 at 08:23 AM by luke Highlight this comment 629

Thanks for the video Buzz..

Posted on December 12, 2010 at 08:32 AM by Steve Highlight this comment 630

Yes, Buzz, thanks. You can see where they're doing the construction work, looks like the Trap sign has been removed in preparation for the conversion to a dual-video screen stadium.

Posted on December 12, 2010 at 09:22 AM by luke Highlight this comment 631

Mother nature gives the Vikes a helping hand in their stadium quest: Metrodome Roof Collapses

Posted on December 12, 2010 at 09:40 AM by Rick 632

What a beautiful sight. Now dump 2 tons of gasoline on it and light a match!

Posted on December 12, 2010 at 10:22 AM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 633

Images are surprisingly hard to come by, but here's one:


Posted on December 12, 2010 at 12:19 PM by Rick 634

The Strib now has a gallery.

Posted on December 12, 2010 at 12:22 PM by Rick 635

The video is pretty epic! Click name!

Posted on December 12, 2010 at 12:27 PM by The Sooj Highlight this comment 636

i bet the vikes are loving this! its funny the only thing i care about out of this is where the hell is twinsfest gonna be? i really wanted to go back to the dome for that they sell beer and brats !

Posted on December 12, 2010 at 12:46 PM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 637

Awesome video!

Posted on December 12, 2010 at 1:06 PM by Rick 638

So the Twins, with their outdoor stadium, managed to go this year without having any more weather-related postponements than the Vikings, even with a gazillion times as many games. :):)

Posted on December 12, 2010 at 3:40 PM by Steve Highlight this comment 639

Watching that dome collapse video, all I can think of is how lucky it was that no one got hurt.

Posted on December 12, 2010 at 5:54 PM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 640

This was going to be my first time back at the dome to watch any event and I was really looking forward to having a 1/2# dog.

I want to buy tickets to next Monday night's game, but I am concerned that it may be moved and I would be out money with buying from some unreliable/untrustworthy seller.

Posted on December 13, 2010 at 11:03 AM by tk Highlight this comment 641

My guess is that it will take more than a week to repair the tears, do the testing, and re-inflate.

Posted on December 13, 2010 at 12:04 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 642

Everything I have read and heard said, that actions are going on behind the scenes that if the Dome is unplayable next Monday that the game will be moved to TCF Bank stadium and that, that decision will be made by probably Thursday.

Posted on December 13, 2010 at 12:28 PM by firedog Highlight this comment 643

Yep hard to believe they could get the dump ready in that short of time frame! Got to believe the pipes may be starting to burst in there with no heat also! Gonna take alot of shoveling to get the bank ready by monday also? Capacity much smaller at the bank also right? Where will they put the extra ticket holders? No Beer also? I see the hight next monday is 20 with low of 13!

Posted on December 13, 2010 at 4:05 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 644

The season is over for Favre. I am not that disappointed that I would be missing the game tonight...

Posted on December 13, 2010 at 5:11 PM by TK Highlight this comment 645

To clarify, that last comment is speculation, but he is not suiting up tonight.

Posted on December 13, 2010 at 5:13 PM by TK Highlight this comment 646

Good grief, the Dome collapses then Favre goes inactive.
I agree TK, maybe the stars are all aligned properly...and he'll finally hang it up for good. Ya think?

Posted on December 13, 2010 at 5:40 PM by luke Highlight this comment 647

In 1982, the dome collapsed at the end of the season, but that was the strike year, and an extra game was attached to each team's schedule, bringing Dallas to the dome about a week after the collapse, if memory serves me right. That was the game that saw Tony Dorsett take a handofff 99 yeards to set a league record for longest play from scrimage.
Don't be surprised if the game goes on as scheduled.

Posted on December 13, 2010 at 9:07 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 648

I really hope they play at TCF next Monday, I would love to go to that game. What is the Vikings season ticket base? Is it more than 50,000? I'm guessing they would get priority.

My guess if they decide to hold the game there the regents would give a special exemption to allow the sale of bottled beer at the stadium. But they are self-righteous asses so who knows.

Posted on December 14, 2010 at 02:14 AM by Duffman Highlight this comment 649

Or maybe fans could struggle through a game sober.

Posted on December 14, 2010 at 02:55 AM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 650

Anybody have any luck with the seat relocation to date?

Posted on December 14, 2010 at 09:34 AM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 651

They don't need to sell beer at TCF (if the Vikes play there on Monday). It will be WAY too easy to simply slip a flask in the inside pocket of your bulky snowmobile suit!!!! :)

I'm really hoping for that game to be played outside....If they make the announcement, I'll pay whatever it takes to get a couple of tickets.

Posted on December 14, 2010 at 10:54 AM by Fred Highlight this comment 652

I don't know. If I'm the Vikings right now, playing somewhere far away from the hometown fans seems like the preferred option.

Oh, if only it weren't for that pesky money issue...

Posted on December 14, 2010 at 11:01 AM by Rick 653

As for Twins ticket re-location (although it looks like the Vikings might have an even bigger ticket re-location issue!), I had no luck! I was trying to go from a 4-seats/20-game package to a 4-seats/40-game package, but there was virtually nothing available in the Field Terrace seating that we have been in and wanted to stay in. And we weren't interested in going to more expensive seating areas. The Twins ticket office warned us that might be the case and I guess they were right. So we'll stay put with our 20-game package in the same seats we had in 2010. Things could be worse, I guess.

Posted on December 14, 2010 at 11:29 AM by EagleEyes Highlight this comment 654

I had a couple of "OK" improvements available. I went a bit closer to the plate and stayed in row two of first base side terrace. No great shakes.

Posted on December 14, 2010 at 12:40 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 655

I was just hoping to upgrade my 20 game plan within the same price areas (and to change from Plan C to Plan F - different/better days and games for us). Not much available. I could have moved back to row 12, but didn't b/c it gets too windy and cold up where we sit in the cheap seats!

Posted on December 14, 2010 at 12:59 PM by BR Highlight this comment 656

Selling beer at a game has nothing to with the fans sobrity.

Let's say a 16 oz. Bottle of Bud light costs around $1.50 each for the U to purchase and sell. (this includes paying the distributer, and wages). Still probably a bit high. Then you sell that beer for $7.50, to an average to 1 per fan. Probably a bit low. That would be $300,000 a game profit the team would be losing. That's a lot of money the Vikings (and the gophers too) could make if they sold beer at TCF.

Posted on December 14, 2010 at 1:19 PM by Duffman Highlight this comment 657

In other great news John Gordan will only be doing 90 Twins game next year. Which means 72 wonderful games where I don't have to hear "swiiiiiing and a miss" causing me to rip my radio from the boat console and throw it in to the lake.

http://www.startribune.com/local/111866119.html?elr=KArksLckD8EQDUoaEyqyP4O:DW3ckUiD3aPc:_Yyc:aULPQL7PQLanchO7DiUsX

Posted on December 14, 2010 at 1:28 PM by Duffman Highlight this comment 658

I don't mind getting a little less of Gordo!
Meanwhile, with John reducing his overall schedule, we determined there was an opportunity to feature some historic Twins voices from seasons gone by. Bob Kurtz and Ted Robinson are not only highly respected broadcasters, but they also have first-hand experience and an understanding of the importance of Twins radio across Twins Territory."

Posted on December 14, 2010 at 2:32 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 659

I wanted to experience the sun on the third base side so I was lucky there were some seats available and essentially swapped my seats in section 102, row 26 with section 126 row 14...basically same distance from home plate, but twelve rows lower on the third base side.

I enjoyed section 102, but it will be nice to try the third base side of the ballpark and get some sun for those early and late season afternoon games.

Overall, I was happy with my "upgrade/relocation"

Posted on December 14, 2010 at 3:59 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 660

"Selling beer at a game has nothing to with the fans sobrity."

I'm hard pressed to agree with that statement, since I find myself surrounded by drunks at every Vikings game. These guys shell out about $42 a game just on beer for themselves.
My point is, is it necesssary to drink beer or alcohol when watching a sporting event? Can't fans get through ONE GAME without alcohol? Is it so integral to the game day experience? Each fan would have to answer that question for themselves, but if the answer is "yes," then perhaps that needs further examination.

Posted on December 14, 2010 at 5:30 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 661

Vikings game Monday to be played at TCF Bank Stadium.

Posted on December 14, 2010 at 7:20 PM by firedog Highlight this comment 662

I just went to check prices out on Stub Hub for the game, all tickets were just dumped for the dome and now the venue already reads TCF Stadium, but no one selling must have realized this. I wonder how long it will take for people to realize this. I really want to go to this game, and I wonder what the secondary market will be for tickets?

Posted on December 14, 2010 at 9:47 PM by tk Highlight this comment 663

Even the Minnesota Ticket Master ticket exchange has shut down...must be trying to figure this all out. I am still leary of purchasing any tickets until it is all figured out.

Sorry to derail the baseball talk, but I guess this is no worse that the other non-baseball stuff that has been discussed recently, and we are talking outdoor ball :)

Posted on December 14, 2010 at 10:01 PM by tk Highlight this comment 664

Ok was able to get in and relocate seats in my 20 game pack. No luck in moving down 3 sections to 323, 324, 0r 325 rows 1-7. Ended up moving down to row 4 from 7! Slim to nothing availale for 20 game packs! Other than that no issues with the sight!

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 11:31 AM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 665

Be interesting to see if they can get TCF ready. Man thats just a ton of snow to move around there! Sounds like the humpty dump still losing panels from weight of snow. Will they ever be able to get that thing fixed? I hear they have a monster truck show and twins fest scheduled for late Jan. They are going to spead about a mil to get TCF ready. Be intersting to see if they wreck the field turf with all the trucks there. Might have been better off sending this game to St Louis or Indy or something! What a nightmare. Good luck getting close to that place to park with all the snow on the streets as it is!

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 11:35 AM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 666

If the game is played at TCF, I wonder what types of stories we will see about people who bought tickets on secondary market and would possibly get shut out. This is one game I would be weary about buying tickets on the secondary market for.

I hope that there is strong communication out there to help avoid this (e.g. what tickets are valid if they reissue tickets to original seat holder, etc.) I guess it is wait and see.

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 11:41 AM by tk Highlight this comment 667

It just sounds like a nightmare how they are going to try and figure out what 15,000 will not get in and where the hell you will sit once you do get in there! If security is gonna do pat downs you might be lucky to get in that place by halftime. No updates on alcohol yet either. The boys may have bitten off more than they can handle. I also hear more snow on the way for Monday!!!

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 11:50 AM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 668

I would think they could do so much more for ticket holders online in advance of the game and make this much easier. I'm amazed at how resistant to technology these teams are when it comes to certain concepts.

They could have started that process on Monday, and now it's Thursday afternoon.

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 12:33 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 669

Hey if anybody does get tickets to the vikings game and doesn't want to deal with the cold/snow and general hassle i've got pretty good wild tickets (lower bowl row 12 don't remember the section but not quite behind the net)for the same night and would love to trade. It's a pair of tickets valued at $66 dollars each, and i'm looking for any seat at tcfbank. Email me if your interested.

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 12:51 PM by jp Highlight this comment 670

The Vikings remain to be quiet about the situation, and by the nature of this, I am guessing there are some major snags they are running into. Likely the NFLPA

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 1:09 PM by tk Highlight this comment 671

I mean it has been almost 24 hours since the Vikings have updated their latest update...

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 1:10 PM by tk Highlight this comment 672

Dr. X, once again you are looking at serving alcohol from the wrong perspective. The guy that spend $42 a game on beer is exactly who the Vikings (and the gophers should) want at the game. Selling beer at games is a massive revenue source. You seem determined to figure out if people need to have alcohol during a football. The answer is no, but when you ask "does it make watching football more enjoyable?" the answer is obviously yes. If it didn't, people wouldn't drink at games because it would be too expensive.

As for tickets to the game, I am assuming they would go by season ticket price levels, and seniority within those price levels. It is amazing that they have not yet started that process, probably want to make sure they will be playing at TCF before they start assigning seats.

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 2:11 PM by Duffman Highlight this comment 673

Looks like we won't have Ullger to blame anymore. This is, I believe, a Good Thing.

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 2:18 PM by Rick 674

Well, I like that he won't be coaching 3rd anymore, but I wish he was just gone completely.

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 2:33 PM by AJ Highlight this comment 675

I heard a report the the whitties were close to signing meatball Crain last night on the local news? Any reports? I see Matt G going to the Dodgers!

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 2:36 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 676

Now if Rick Anderson and his 100 pitch count could leave that would be great.

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 2:50 PM by Duffman Highlight this comment 677

TwinkFan,

You are correct, all sources point and are confirmed that Crain is going to Sox.

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 3:13 PM by tk Highlight this comment 678

http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/blogs/112019754.html?elr=KArksLckD8EQDUoaEyqyP4O:DW3ckUiD3aPc:_Yyc:aU1yDEmP:QMDCinchO7DU

All seats are general admission at TCF....100 Dome = 100 level TCF 200 Dome = 200 TCF

No alcohol...

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 3:14 PM by tk Highlight this comment 679

What time the gates open I wonder? Could be a stampeed in there!!! I for one will be glad I'm not part of that mess!!!

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 3:22 PM by TwinkFan Highlight this comment 680

Duffman,
Why does beer make the game more enjoyable? I've got nothing against drinking - heck, I've done my share of stupid stuff after too many - but for some it seems necessary. And since a lot of these people have already been drinking prior to kickoff, by the time the game starts either at 3:15 or 7:30, they're pretty well inebriated, and many of them ruin the gameday experience for others.
I'm no longer going to Vikings games because a group of drunken meatheads now occupy the seats directly behind us. The foul language bothers people around them, and when they start falling into people in the seats in front of them, as has happened to me this year, it doesn't appear as if their gameday experience has been enhanced by the addition of alcohol either.
Don't get me wrong; I know most people enjoy beer in moderation and are polite and amiable neighbors in the dome. But would it be so bad to sit through one game without alcohol?

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 5:17 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 681

Patrick Ramsey? There are no stats on this guy since 2008. Does he even remember what a football looks like?

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 5:20 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 682

i know this is going to sound crazy, but for once i agree with Dr. X on a topic.

who knew?!?!

;-)

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 5:31 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 683

I remember my years working security at the dome in my high school days. I saw some pretty interesting things and as security we had full access to reports of all the incidents that occurred during each game.

I always liked working pre-season games, because those seemed to be fans that were there to watch a game or not give the unruly fans enough time to drink before everyone left.

I will never forget the time a guy in the upper deck urinated on the fans in front of him....

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 5:58 PM by tk Highlight this comment 684

Since TC Traders does not do Vikings, anyone with tickets that want to dump to someone who is willing to wait in line and possibly get shut-out, let me know! E-mail linked to name.

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 6:32 PM by tk Highlight this comment 685

Actual excerpt from tonight's dinner conversation:

Victoria: "Who wants to drink ice cold beer outside in the winter?"

Me: "Who wants to watch the Vikings sober?"

* * *

Projected differences in fan comments between the two types of games:

Beer game: "Wooo hoo! Vikings rock! You guys suck! Fire Childress!"

Dry game: "That play might have been successful if the quarterback could have raised his throw by four degrees and added approximately 3 miles per hour in speed. Still, the nickle defense was exceedingly well executed on that play. Oh, and ... Vikings suck!"

* * *

Seriously, the fan base will certainly survive one dry game. But it's about revenue, and the team will be leaving a lot of money on the table -- something they certainly are already doing by moving the game there in the first place.

The sheer novelty of seeing Vikings football outdoors (on the 29th anniversary of the last such home game, no less) will make up for a lot of things. I had to admit to Vic that even I (a guy who watches football pretty casually and has never been to a single Vikings game) would love to go to this one. It just sounds so...pure.

You just know that it will probably be another 29 years before such a thing happens again (barring a temporary move to TCFBS to allow construction of a new facility on the Metrodome site).

* * *

I heard it suggested today that moving the game to Phoenix would make way more sense because they could actually fill the place with transplanted Vikings fans.

And sell beer.

* * *

Do you suppose that the Metrodome could be converted to an outdoor facility by simply not putting another roof on, and raising some light standards? (Not likely, but an interesting thought experiment.)

There seems to be no hurry over there to get the thing fixed. I'll go out on a limb now and predict many more failed panels over the coming weeks, and TwinsFest at the Convention Center this year. (Monster truck rallies? Meh. The world may be better off without them.)

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 8:02 PM by Rick 686

Sounds like it's almost a done deal for Nishioka, 3 year $10 Million, not bad for $15 million gamble.

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 8:11 PM by tk Highlight this comment 687

Scouring the recesses of my limited memory:

Over the decade (or so) of Twins' stadium debate, a call would come in from a listener during CCO's Sports Huddle (about every other week) who'd suggest: "Why don't they just take the Teflon roof off of the Metrodome and then they'd have their open-air stadium?" during which Sir Sidney would very angrily and predictably interrupt, "WE'VE DISCUSSED THIS ALREADY! TRUST ME! IT CAN'T BE DONE! YOU DON'T KNOW ANYTHING! IT SIMPLY CAN'T BE DONE!" and hang up on the caller, end of discussion. Made for funny stuff, or at least the first dozen times you heard it coming.

So today, 'CCO-TV reported that it wasn't just the integrity of the Metrodome's roof that was of concern, but there were "safety concerns throughout the entire building."

Could it be that my close personal friend Sid was right all along?

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 8:30 PM by schweady Highlight this comment 688

Is trading Morales a good thing? I guess that tabs Butera as the backup. Not sure how I feel about that.

When the Nishi press conference happens, I hope a reporter asks him if one of the first things he'll buy with his new contract money is a car. I just want to hear Nishi exclaim, "AUTO-MOBILE!!??"

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 9:12 PM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 689

Rick, in regards to that dinner comment. I harken back to an episode of Cheers:

Diane: Why do you drink ice cold beer on a cold day?
Norm: Mr. Clavin
Cliff: What else you gonna do with it?

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 9:18 PM by luke Highlight this comment 690

Taking the roof off the dome won't increase revenue streams. The Vikings don't care about a return to outdoor football, they care about enhanced revenues.

Posted on December 16, 2010 at 10:25 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 691

Dr. X your last comment has proved my entire point of view, pro sport are all about revenue.

The reason I said beer makes a game more enjoyable is, because if it didn't why would some spend money on it? No one is going to spend a large amount of money on beer if it makes the game a less enjoyable experience.

As for this first come, first serve ticket policy what the hell are people supposed to do for 2 1/2 hours in 0 degree weather waiting for the game to start? They need to bump the gate open later or people are going get frostbite from sitting outside for 6 hours.

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 03:38 AM by Duffman Highlight this comment 692

Sony has decided to retain Joe's services as cover athlete on PS3's The Show. Perhaps we'll get more "Well played Mauer" at the ballpark this year. No commercial yet but a trailer featuring game footage is available. It is to be available in 3D and compatible with "move".

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 04:16 AM by NotMendoza Highlight this comment 693

That still doesn't answer the queestion as to why it makes the game more enjoyable. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that if they're blowing $7 a throw on beer that they see it as an enjoyable addition to being at the game. I just want to know why or how it makes their gameday experience so much better that they're willing to piss away $7 bucks for each bottle of beer.

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 05:57 AM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 694

About the Dome, I'm pretty sure I've heard for the last few years that it really isn't possible to just rip off the roof. I can't remember the reasons off the top of my head, but they made sense.

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 07:39 AM by AJ Highlight this comment 695

You can't just take the roof off the dome for the same reason you can't just take the roof off your house. The interior of the dome was not designed and built to be exposed to the elements. I would imagine the largest concern would be water drainage. There just isn't anywhere for rain or snow to melt and safely go. Could they retrofit it? Probably. But it wouldn't be cheap, and it would put the facility out of comission for a while.

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 08:48 AM by ajax Highlight this comment 696

I somewhat remember a 'study' about removing the roof from the Metrodome. Estimated cost was something like $100 million - mostly for new standards and supports for lights and speakers (since those are hanging from the roof now.)...

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 08:51 AM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 697

Speaking of stadium design...why did they not install a heated playing surface at TCF Bank Stadium? This was supposed to be a "state of the art stadium"?

I don't think it would have been too difficult to add some heating coils beneath that FieldTurf when they constructed the stadium.

Last I knew, the Big Ten football season went well into November and they should have installed a heated surface. They also should have installed some radiant heaters throughout the stadium and in the restrooms. It can be 65 degrees in November, but it can also be 15 degrees and snowing in November.

I don't know how much extra money that would have cost, but it's MINNESOTA and they should think of weather issues/factors when designing things. Will they ever learn to do things right the first time?

The Twins were great with their design of Target Field and they play from April through September...The Gophers play well into November beyond Thanksgiving. It gets cold in Minnesota in October and November.

I was just surprised to hear that the field was not heated at TCF considering the Gophers play well into November.

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 10:11 AM by Mike Highlight this comment 698

Mike,

It may get cold in November but is it likely that the turf would freeze hard? Probably not regularly enough to warrant the added cost of putting in the heat coils under the field. The Twins added them more for thawing out and greening up the grass before the season starts, as well as warming up the turf so it doesn't play like concrete. It would be interesting to know whether other schools like Wisconsin or Michigan have heat coils under the turf.

To baseball - did any of you season ticket holders sit in on the phone call with the Twins last night?

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 11:17 AM by Stevie B Highlight this comment 699

Hudson is going to the Padres. Hudson said five teams had been calling him, with two-year and three-year deals.

Still, he said he expects the deal with the Padres to be announced later on Friday.

Ken Rosenthal of FOXSports.com tweets Hudson's deal is for two years, worth $11.5 million.

Looks like we keep accumulating those draft picks.

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 12:20 PM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 700

Currious to see what the middle infield will look like next year. Assuming Nishioka will play short who would you rather see playing second on a daily basis? Casilla, Tolbert, Plouffe or a re-signed Punto?

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 1:07 PM by PNB19 Highlight this comment 701

Draft pick for Hudson...he was type B so the Padres dont give up a pick

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 1:11 PM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 702

HipFlasks.com is reporting a flood of expedited shipping orders to Midwest addresses. A company spokesman said orders exceed 53,000 and he was unsure the demand could be met in the time-frame requested.

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 1:27 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 703

You are asking me for the pyshological reason behind people drinking? I don't know, unlike you, I'm not a doctor.

What I do know is beer tastes good and gets you drunk. I dont really care what the persons reason for doing it is. It's their choice. I was looking at selling beer at games more from a business perspective of how much money it brings into the team. Money the Gophers could really use, maybe to help find a better AD.

Also, there is a big difference between needing to get drunk at games and wanting to. From my experience most people who need to get drunk are not going to waste money on a football game, but find a bottle of karkov and guzzle it like water. No one needs to get drunk for football games, but it seems they want to.

I know being drunk made a lot of boring SCSU hockey games during college more fun.

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 2:01 PM by Duffman Highlight this comment 704

People like popcorn at movies too. Not worried why. I understand drinkers can take away enjoyment from others, but that's a separate issue. So can obnoxious non-drinkers.

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 2:06 PM by robin Highlight this comment 705

By obnoxious non-drinkers, I don't mean non-drinkers or anti-drinkers, just people who can be annoying for any reason, loud talking about their business, constantly getting up, etc.

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 2:08 PM by robin Highlight this comment 706

PNB19-
I don't think Nishioka will be the SS. I've heard he doesn't have a good enough arm for it. Plus, all Gardy has talked about is Casilla at SS.

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 2:23 PM by AJ Highlight this comment 707

PatMears:

A team that loses a Type B player receives a supplemental pick, but the signing team does not lose a pick.

YOu are correct that the Padres don't lose a pick, however we did pick up a supplemental pick for both Crain and Hudson. We knew that neither would accept our offer, however by making an offer we insured we would get a couple of picks in return.

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 3:05 PM by minn55441 Highlight this comment 708

Just out of curiosity, any one here braving the debacle at TCF Monday?

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 3:19 PM by tk Highlight this comment 709

I'm familiar with the way the arbitration system works.

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 3:46 PM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 710

Regarding Nishioka,
It seemed usual that the Twins, in a small market, could outbid the Red Sox for the rights to negitiate with this guy. Do I have that correct? I can't say how set the Sox feel in their midddle infield, but if the Twins outbid them, they can't be as high on him as the Twins. I thought I read that Nishioka will get a 3 year, $10 million deal with the Twins. Are they overpaying for this guy?

And my final comments on beer (horray!) will be this: I know no one can explain the motivations and actions of anyone but themselves. I suppose a nice, crisp, cold one on a hot day, or even a chilly day, is fine in moderation. There are smells, sounds, and tastes that we associate with certain activities, and those activites might not seem quite right without them, like Thanksgiving without the smell of roast turkey. But when guys start showing up at games totally polluted, it seems like they've gone beyong having one or two just to complete the package, so to speak. Then I wonder if there's not a problem there.

Carrie Nation has left the building!

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 5:14 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 711

Stevie B,
Yea, I sat in on the Danny Valencia/Ben Revere phone call..It's the 1st time they had did it and it went well.I never got to answer a question or win a prize but it was interesting.

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 7:01 PM by Steve Highlight this comment 712

tk,

Hell yeah I am going to TCFBS on Monday! Got the tix for free and I am planning on taking a flask. Added bonus, I get to see the Joe Webb era begin. ha!

CSG Mike

Posted on December 17, 2010 at 10:35 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 713

stevie b - exactly. my understanding is none of the big ten football stadiums have heating systems underneath their fields. and rightfully so. why?

1.) because it is completely unnecessary in the big ten footprint considering the timefram of the regular season.

2.) tcf stadium is A COLLEGE FOOTBALL STADIUM built to the specs and requirements of a college football regular season length. it is not an nfl venue in use during late december and january.

3.) as someone else already stated the big ten football regular season is over by november 20 something every year. and even in minneapolis or madison or east lansing or ann arbor or iowa city it is still a rather rare occurance to have snow sticking to the ground in mid/late november and it is rare to have daytime temps (i.e. all big ten football games are required to be day games once november 1st hits) below 35-40 degrees. 5.) so there was absolutely no reason for the U of M to have to or need to shell out millions of addiitional dollars to install an underground field heating system that would RARELY (and i emphasize RARELY) be used.

the U of M got it right with the construction of tcf bank stadium. it is state of the art and was also built to the proper weather specs of the big ten regular season.

Posted on December 18, 2010 at 12:40 AM by Betaband Highlight this comment 714

I will also being enjoying the game in person Monday night, with a liter of Jameson, just to stay warm. I will be down there about 3 pm.

Posted on December 18, 2010 at 01:22 AM by Duffman Highlight this comment 715

Continuing Minnesota's insatiable hunger to be a national embarrassment: the Big Dump in the Dumpty made # 3 on Yahoo's top ten videos list (Click my name for the full ten list) :(. *Sigh

From henceforth, that is what it will be known as: The Big Dump in the Dumpty

Posted on December 18, 2010 at 09:33 AM by luke Highlight this comment 716

Sorry Luke - it will always be known as the Metrodome to me. Home of many fond memories, including the '85 All Star Game, the '87 World Series and the '91 World Series.

Posted on December 18, 2010 at 2:54 PM by clublevelfan Highlight this comment 717

...Three players getting their 3,000th hit, Alexi Cassilla's game winning hit in game 163, Twins' homecoming after winning the '87 ALC,
Pink Floyd, Rolling Stones, U2, NCAA Final Four, Super Bowl XXVI...

Posted on December 18, 2010 at 3:48 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 718

"And we'll see you --- tomorrow night!"

Posted on December 18, 2010 at 5:16 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 719

Great memories! And let's not forget some of the best Monster Truck events in Minnesota history.

Posted on December 18, 2010 at 7:41 PM by clublevelfan Highlight this comment 720

I can't believe that no one has mentioned the real crisis following the collapsed roof: no roller skating.

Posted on December 18, 2010 at 7:49 PM by Rick 721

And where will the Hmong New Year celebration go?

Posted on December 18, 2010 at 7:52 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 722

clublevel - I gotta agree with you on that. I saw my fair share of monster trucks and supercross' at the Dumpty in my day. Last monster truck show I went to in 2008, they said that the Dumpty was one of the best places on the whole circuit. They, unlike the Vikings, Twins and Gophers thought the Dumpty was built really well for their events, and they loved coming here.
Unless they're concerned about the structural integrity of the whole building since The Big Dump, I can't see why RollerDome couldn't still go on. People don't rollerskate/blade on the field, it's in the concourses.

Posted on December 19, 2010 at 12:35 PM by luke Highlight this comment 723

Anyone know where a guy can get a good deal on vikes tickets for tomorrow nights snow-bowl? I'm looking for a few seats on either level.

Posted on December 19, 2010 at 3:25 PM by lindywig Highlight this comment 724

And, clublevel, have you ever noticed that the only reason Minnesota ever gets national attention is when bad things happen? The national media never comes here for something good, it's always because of some sort of tragedy:
- 1989 Jacob Wetterling disappears, no one knows where he is to this day
- 1991 US Open, 4 spectators killed after a thunderstorm
- 1991 An unGodly blizzard wipes out the state
- 1998 We elect a washed-up pro wrestler as governor
- 1998 (somewhere in there) National media goes nuts after the T-Wolves actually win more than 45 games in a season
- 1999 Andrew Cunnanan, who turned out to be a mass-murderer got his start here
- 2000 Some hack from the 1970s who was a mass terrorist was found here
- 2007 Bridge collapses
- 2008 National nominating convention complete with broken windows, anarchists in the street and riots
- 2010 Gophers fire Brewster
- 2010 Vikes fire Chili
- 2010 UnGodly blizzard wipes out the state again
- 2010 Metrodome collapses
- 2010 Metrodome collapses again
- 2010 College stadium used for NFL game
- 2010 NFL players deem college stadium is "like concrete" and really don't want to play here

Posted on December 19, 2010 at 4:14 PM by luke Highlight this comment 725

luke - you are a weird dude.......just weird.

that is all.

Posted on December 19, 2010 at 4:33 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 726

will be at my first vikings game since 1998, it will be fun.. i dont care where they make us sit..

Luke you are a little too much.. have you registered in your area b4 you moved in? i think you and moes need to stay awayfrom the kids

Posted on December 19, 2010 at 9:40 PM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 727

That is the single weirdest digest of Minnesota history that I've ever seen.

Posted on December 19, 2010 at 9:59 PM by Rick 728

What's interesting is that almost half of the most influential happenings in the state of Minnesota since 1989 all happened in 2010! Quite a year!

Posted on December 19, 2010 at 10:29 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 729

I have 1 extra ticket for tomorrow night if anyone wants go

Posted on December 20, 2010 at 01:11 AM by Duffman Highlight this comment 730

This whole Vikings thing is so confusing. They say they are going to release more information, but only have shared parking information and what you cannot do.

Also, they say you cannot line up prior to 4pm...I am sure there will be people lining up prior to then, but where? 100 entrance points? I thought there were only 5-6 entrances?

Hang out in Williams arena first? To do what? You have concessions and tv's...okay? What about the mad rush to leave there to go and wait in line?

There is no information out there, at least none that I can find. I only read about the Kluwe complaining.

Posted on December 20, 2010 at 01:17 AM by TK Highlight this comment 731

Luke,

Has it ever occurred to you that maybe, just maybe Minnesota asks for and deserves all the bad ink and attention it gets from the national press? I am always amazed at the incredible inferiority complex that so many Minnesotans have. They think the whole world hates them and is out to get them. Luke, the reality is, most of the world and the country for that matter really doesn't give a shit about Minnesota so try not to lose too much sleep over it.

Posted on December 20, 2010 at 08:10 AM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 732

maz - haha. THAT was a little too much :).
Rick - weird, perhaps. But it's true.
Kev - LOL. Honestly, I don't blame you for moving to AZ...I'd love to be where you are right now.

Posted on December 20, 2010 at 10:17 AM by luke Highlight this comment 733

Luke - that is one heck of an analysis so to say...how can you mention the Jesse Ventura election but not include the Franken-Coleman debacle???

Anyways, not to sound selfish or anything, but I think its time for a new post Rick...its been 56 days! The offseason is more than half-over with pitchers and catchers reporting in just 58 days!

Posted on December 20, 2010 at 1:05 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 734

forgot one (although the year is not worth confirming, it goes something like this):
- 2009 luke posts for the first time on ballparkmagic.com

Posted on December 20, 2010 at 1:15 PM by schweady Highlight this comment 735

*GASP* Mike! I can't believe I forgot that one! Yeow, that was one of the stupider things to happen here that got national media attention.
Schweady, I've been posting here longer than that...lol.

Posted on December 20, 2010 at 2:42 PM by luke Highlight this comment 736

Anybody a Twins Territory Team member? Is it worth the $20?

Posted on December 20, 2010 at 2:51 PM by Go Go Twins Highlight this comment 737

I've wondered the same Go Go. I got an email from the Twins today about signing up. I know a tour of TF is included in the membership.

Posted on December 20, 2010 at 4:07 PM by luke Highlight this comment 738

wtf?

Posted on December 20, 2010 at 5:51 PM by BULLDOG Highlight this comment 739

re: Twins Territory membership - I don't think it's worth the $20. The biggest value is the GameDay audio feature and that's available for $15 elsewhere and as part of MLB At Bat.

Too few team specific benefits for the extra $5.

Posted on December 20, 2010 at 8:18 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 740

I know this is a little late, but the relocation process for me went just fine. Got in without any problems, and moved from 320 row 9 to 102 row 26. 20 game C, which is what I had last year.

Posted on December 20, 2010 at 9:15 PM by antifire Highlight this comment 741

I was a Twins Territory member before the price went up & before I got season tickets. It was worth it back then, but it isn't now.

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 07:52 AM by AJ Highlight this comment 742

The relocation process went very well for us. We started in section 304 row 11 in package E, and we moved to section 307 (the closest section to home plate in the $11 seat area) row 11 in package D (I think). We had the option to move down to row 5 in 304, but decided to move closer to home plate. I think if you have 20 game packages, your odds of moving were a lot greater. There were open seats all over the place when we we picking our seats (3:15 on Wednesday the 15th).

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 08:33 AM by Tyler Highlight this comment 743

Imagine if TF had not opened last year. What kind of contingency plan could the Twins have come up with for their games if roof panels continued to collapse and the dome remained unplayable into a baseball season?

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 08:56 AM by Stevie B Highlight this comment 744

Rick, are you planning to write soon? Maybe about the Dome?

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 10:46 AM by michael Highlight this comment 745

Well, I've actually been writing all along, but trying to put the finishing touches on a bunch of big stuff, and it just takes time.

Unfortunately, I also have to make a living, and this is my busy season for choral music and video transfers (my actual occupations).

I have some more "places" posts pretty much ready, so I'll try to start with those again over the holidays. Then the big stuff will probably all come out in a flood of posts in January.

Anybody out there looking for somebody to write about ballparks full time...?

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 10:59 AM by Rick 746

As for the Dome, it's such a sad sight.

One of the TV stations reported that they had to literally shoot holes in some panels yesterday to relieve the pressure, and the Strib is reporting that another panel has failed.

There have to be some big ramifications to the building as a whole after being exposed to the cold for so long. They probably had to winterize a bunch of stuff, and the turf (which was in terrible shape anyway) will probably be further ruined by all the machinery and frozen water.

Everybody is trying to stay optimistic (including the Twins), but I can't join them. I think the building is down until spring, then the reclamation can begin in earnest -- if the Legislature hasn't approved a replacement by then.

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 11:17 AM by Rick 747

Stevie, that's a good question. Thank God for TF.
I know some people are going to think I'm nuts, but whatever: I wonder if the Twins might have considered Montreal's Olympic Stadium as a temporary home. Since Olympic Stadium was vacated several years ago, there aren't any teams using it, so if the Twins were still at the Dome they might have been able to relocate to Montreal for a year. The NBA's Hornets relocated to Oklahoma City for two years after Katrina, so it's not like it hasn't been done before. Just a thought. But thank God this wasn't the 2009 season.

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 12:21 PM by luke Highlight this comment 748

Maybe they could have shared Kaufmann Stadium with the Royals for a short term. Plenty of Twins fans make that road trip anyway and the folks in KC could finally see a real major league baseball team.

Hey-o!

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 3:51 PM by Stevie B Highlight this comment 749

lol Stevie. That was a good one.

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 5:35 PM by luke Highlight this comment 750

Luke:

We are way past the point of thinking you're nuts. It is certified. Montreal? Are you kidding me (Jim Mora voice)?

I remember you mentioning kicking Joanie to the curb. Remember tis the season to flex that Pimp Hand with the ladies Luke...

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 7:40 PM by Max Highlight this comment 751

Well, Max, where else the hell would you have put the Twins next season if The Big Dump at the Dumpty had in fact impeded the season? Let me guess, that Field of Dreams thing down in Ames, IA?
Detroit? Milwaukee? Chicago? Oh wait, they all have teams in their ballparks. Did the Stade d' Olympique suck like dog sh*t on the bottom of your shoe? Yeah. Worse than the Metrodome matter of fact...but it's a facility that would have been ready to house a team, even if temporarily. Seriously, I'd love to know where you would have put the Twins if The Big Dump at the Dumpty had happened two years ago...sheesh.
And, yes, I've found someone else :).

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 8:48 PM by luke Highlight this comment 752

Field of Dreams is in Dyersville, IA

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 9:06 PM by TK Highlight this comment 753

Whoever she is Luke, she's not putting out enough....You're almost as bitchy as I am.

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 10:21 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 754

For Rick and all you other Met lovers out there...click my name

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 10:27 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 755

part 2

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 10:34 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 756

What's the name of that minor league park in Des Moines? I mean really, how many Twins fans would make enough regular trips that far to warrent a bigger park? Surely the Twins would be carrying some kind of insurance that would insulate them from a steep revenue drop that a relocation would cause.

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 10:41 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 757

Geez, Kevin that hurt to watch footage of the old place. I just miss it so much.

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 11:07 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 758

Ah, to the Metrodome, "like a big empty egg a few miles North" only to have a cracked shell 29 years later.

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 11:27 PM by tk Highlight this comment 759

Thanks for sharing Kevin...wow, from the aerial photos, really shows how the Minneapolis landscape has changed!

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 11:35 PM by tk Highlight this comment 760

So do I dr.x....SO DO I!....I was in tears last night, for the first time in nearly 30 years the Vikings were alive again. I didn't even care about the outcome of the game. Just to see those old purple jerseys with snow flurries falling and breath blowing through the facemasks....For me the Vikings died in 1981 and I really haven't been into them since. I would if they ever went back outside where they belong but we have too many pansies in MN now and people want to spend another $200 million just to host one superbowl a few final fours..blah blah who cares! It's no coincidence they haven't been back to the superbowl since moving into that toilet.

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 11:56 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 761


Getting bored, so here's my pic of the first pitch on opening day last year.

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 10:02 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 762

This from Peter King at SI.com:

"The Metrodome is in big, big trouble.
I was stunned to walk into the building and see at least 20 streams of melted ice and snow falling from the roof to the field and the seating areas, the result of the roof caving in on the morning of Dec. 12. Most of the snow that cascaded down from the compromised roof is still sitting on the field, which is partially covered, crazy-quilt, to try to minimize damage to the field. But the scariest thing -- the thing that could have led to a stampede out of the building if the roof collapse happened when a game was going on -- is the fact that some of the support beams for the roof collapsed, too, and hit some seats in the upper deck. Just imagine the hysteria of 64,000 Metrodomians if they'd see that whole thing happen, and if some of the denizens of the upper deck saw speakers and beams falling down on people. That's one of the reasons why some won't want the Vikes to return to the Dome for the final year of the team's lease in 2011."

Posted on December 21, 2010 at 11:16 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 763

Awesome clips, kev.

And thanks for the confirmation of my hunch, Dr. X.

Last night was a proof-of-concept for the Vikes at TCFBS in the interim (albeit still needing a solution for alcohol).

How fast can the Legislature get this done?

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 12:35 AM by Rick 764

I can honestly say I never paid to attend a Vikings game prior to last night (worked security/event staff) and I would likely pay to continue watching outdoor football. That was fun!

However, Kevin alluded to the thoughts I had about the current generation not wanting to endure these conditions. I personally loved it! When I told my dad I was heading to the game (the man who always told me stories of attending games at the Met), he said I was crazy for going. I politely reminded him of all the memories he shared with me growing up, his response, "Boy, in those day, there were no other options."

Looks like that is what Vikings fans who want outdoor football are going to face, the old man and his memories and one who still refuses to watch the MN Wild...

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 01:55 AM by TK Highlight this comment 765

It will be interesting to see how this session pans out this year.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 01:58 AM by TK Highlight this comment 766

Kevin,
I don't think it has anything to do with people being 'pansies' about the cold. It all has to do with gettting the biggest bang for the state's buck. Why build a facility that will be of no use 3-4 months out of the year when the technology is there to build a building that can be rented out 12 months out of the year? If Minnesota never hosts another Super Bowl, that's fine. But putting up a building that will stand idle 1/3rd to 1/4th of the year doesn't make sense for the state, which most likely would, and should be involveed in a stadium solution. An empty building doeesn't draw anyone into the area, and development around it suffers as a result. That will mean lower property values aand subsequently lower property tax revenues.
I don't buy into the cause and efffect theory about the Vikings and the cold. If playing in cold weather assured teams of being perennial powerhouses, maybe someone can explaing why the Packers sucked throughout the 70s and 80s. It haas more to do with personnel and team culture than the temperature at game time. Dome teams can win Super Bowls; it's been proven possible on three different occassions.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 06:03 AM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 767

Wasn't there discussion of building Target Field with the ability to add a roof later? Maybe someone else here can recall specifically.

I would think this would be the most logical way to get it built for less money now, and put it back on either the owners or the legislature to add a roof in future years.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 08:33 AM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 768

Small thing but the turf at the dome wasn't in bad shape. They put in new turf right before this season started, so it wasn't the same old stuff from when the Twins were playing there. I don't know if they use a different type for indoor vs outdoor installations, but if not then I don't think it will be too badly damaged.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 08:55 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 769

Kev in AZ - actually, my new relationship is the best thing going in my life quite frankly. Everything else going on in my life was the push behind my bitchy response to Max.
That notwithstanding, thank you for those old WCCO clips about the Met. I like seeing old news clips like that, it was pretty cool to watch.
Dr. X - King's comment: "the thing that could have led to a stampede out of the building if the roof collapse happened when a game was going on..." harkened me back to the Twins-Angels game back in 1986 when a thunderstorm tore a hole through the roof. I wasn't at that game, but a friend of mine was there and saw some of the light standards swaying. I remember watching the news that day and watching people make a mad dash for the doors. It was pretty eerie.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 09:37 AM by luke Highlight this comment 770

Been a while. Good to see everyone still around. Interesting side chatter about the Vikes game. Thought I would get a quick post in and link you guys to a couple pics I got from the game before the freezing rain shut me down for the night.

Pre-Game from the upper endzone

Tony doing his best "Green Man" impersonation

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 11:32 AM by Jared Highlight this comment 771

Can someone please explain Green Man? I know I saw him at a Twins game this year sitting in the second deck behind home plate. I went to 40+ games, though, and only remember seeing him once.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 12:31 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 772

I'd like to see the factual data detailing exactly how often and what evens the Dome gets used for outside of the Vikings, early season Gopher Baseball tournament and HS football.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 12:54 PM by Fred Highlight this comment 773

Here's a calendar of this year's events at the Dome, except for big chunks in the summer, it looks like it's used a lot.

Click for calendar

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 1:06 PM by AJ Highlight this comment 774

Dr. X-

I think cold weather affects the game (and seasons) more than you think. You can check the numbers, but cold weather teams have more Super Bowl appearances that do warm weather/dome teams. You can certainly say that personnel affects the game more, but you can't tell me that a cold weather team hosting an NFC/AFC Championship game doesn't gain an advantage over a team playing the majority of their games in a climate controlled environment.

I just don't see the added benefit of spending an addition $200 million of public dollars to put on a roof on a building just so we can host an occasional NCAA regional tournament and, maybe, a single Super Bowl. Those are the only two events that would draw ANY sort of additional revenue to the state and I'm just sure it's worth the cost.

Personally, I think the benefit of playing in an outdoor stadium outweigh the costs of building another dome. Just my opinion.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 1:11 PM by Fred Highlight this comment 775

Thanks AJ-

I see alot of "RollerDome" and "Amateur Baseball"....not exactly revenue generators..... I also see that it basically sits empty during the summer months.

This only further proves to me why $200 million for a roof is a wasted expense.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 1:14 PM by Fred Highlight this comment 776

the "rashad-rosen show" on WCCO channel 4. ha! now that is a classic!

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 1:14 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 777

no roof!

:-)

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 1:15 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 778

I read a report today from the Number 11, that the repairs might take longer than they had initially hoped. Although they didn't name it specifically, it sounds like TwinsFest will be a no-go at the Dome, if repairs take them well into the month of January.
Just my opinion, but I think the Gophers baseball program is pretty pissed off right now, because, if you remember, last year after the departure of the Twins, the Gophers played all their home games at the Dome; not just early February. Can't play at Siebert Field when there's gallons of snow on it.
People like Maz and Kevin in AZ were able to make me a no-roof-convert when it came to TF, and for that I am grateful. I'm incredibly happy TF is roof-less. But, when it comes to a new Vikings stadium around here, I still want a roof. People were excited for one day to sit outdoors for football; but the couple people I know that went to the game certainly do not want outdoor football to become a regular thing around here.
I don't know how much jurisdiction the NFL has when it comes to the stadiums its teams build, but I think even the NFL would put up a huge stink if we tried to build an outdoor stadium here. Just my opinion.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 1:34 PM by luke Highlight this comment 779

Luke-

Why would the NFL raise a stink if we built an open air stadium? Personally, I think the exact opposite, for a couple of reasons:

1) They don't want to have to give Minnesota a Super Bowl as payback for building a stadium with a roof. My bet is they would prefer to keep the Super Bowls in warmer weather locales.

2) The NFL loves to create and promote story lines and the Vikings returning to their old glory of outdoor football would make games more "sexy" for television. Viewers LOVE to watch games in the snow and cold. More viewers means bigger ratings means more $$ for the NFL.

I think just the opposite, I think the NFL PREFERS we build an open air stadium.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 1:40 PM by Fred Highlight this comment 780

I don't think anyone can simply assume that a brand-new, multi-level, suite-containing, multi-purpose indoor stadium in downtown Minneapolis would ONLY be used for exactly the same events that the Metrodome is used for today. Look at Jerry Jones' creation in Dallas. Regular season college basketball games, NBA games, boxing matches, in addition to the requisite monster truck rallies, concerts, and conventions. And don't forget, the new Big 10 conference championship game will be looking for a rotating home.

Personally, I don't care if it has a roof or not. But if an outdoor football-only stadium is built, it should not be built downtown.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 1:50 PM by Expectorate Highlight this comment 781

Green Man is a character that pops up in the TV show Its Always sunny in Philadelphia.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 2:00 PM by Jared Highlight this comment 782

Expectorate makes lots of good points. Fred, I can see your point about the Super Bowl. For instance, St. Louis built a dome 15 years ago, and it hasn't seen a Super Bowl yet. Which irks me a little, because Detroit's new place has had a Super Bowl (2006) and Indy's new RR stadium gets it in 2012 (?), and Saint Louis hasn't even been mentioned when it comes to Super Bowl bidding...I have no idea why. And 2014 will be outdoors at the new Meadowlands Stadium...so there might be hope for us if we do decide open-air.

As far as creating the storyline and the Vikings returning to former glory, and making Vikings games "sexy for television" again, that concept will have a shelf life of about a year, then it will get incredibly dull. When ESPN or VS. broadcasts a Wild home game, they're not talking about the return of the NHL to the State of Hockey ten years later. That was a great storyline for maybe the first couple years of Wild hockey...but now it would be laughable. Same goes for the Twins and TF, next season, the storyline of the Twins returning to the great outdoors won't have as much clout.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 2:15 PM by luke Highlight this comment 783

Luke-

I disagree. There is still alot of television hype and drama around December games played at Lambeau, Solder Field, Rich Stadium, Heinz, etc. Some of that has to do with personnel and how good the teams are, but much has to do with late season games played in the elements. It just adds something that games played in domes can't.

And, Expectorate, NBA games at a new Minnesota Dome? Really? The Wolves are giving away tickets for fans to watch them at Target Center, why on Earth would they consider playing in a cavernous dome? As far as concerts and wrestling goes, we have plenty of venues available for them. Same goes for conventions....hell, we spent alot of money of the Minneapolis Convention Center, didn't we? Truck and tractor pulls can take place during the summer.

A $200 million roof is a misallocation of public funds, IMO.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 2:29 PM by Fred Highlight this comment 784

Fred - forgive me if I don't have the precise schedule finalized for the new stadium, but my point remains the same: A new indoor stadium with all the bells and whistles will offer more possibilities than the Metrodome does. That's all I'm saying. Not saying it's right, not saying it's necessary, not saying they should unequivocally allocate funds to build it. But it would be used for more than "Rollerdome and amateur baseball."

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 2:55 PM by Expectorate Highlight this comment 785

If I were the Wilfs, I would privately invest in a new open-air stadium in the suburbs with a giant parking lot and some development surrounding the area.

However, that will not happen. Public subsidies will be used and to convince the public, its going to result in a retractable roof stadium or a fixed roof dome.

And if they are going to spend the extra $250+ million on the retractable roof stadium, they might as well just have a fixed roof dome such as Detroit for much cheaper.

It will ultimately come down to fixed roof dome or open-air.

A retractable roof would only be open for 5 games or so each year, if even that. How often does Indy have their roof open when the Colts play?

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 3:06 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 786

Expectorate - I get your point....it's just that I think some are putting too much on a facility being "multi-purpose". I wouldn't throw a fit if the new stadium has a roof, but I would be disappointed and would think that the Vikings missed a great opportunity. Fortunately, it looks as though Ziggy is "anti-roof", and with the current economic environment, it's going to be tough enough to get the state or local governments to help out with an open air stadium, let alone contribute another $200 million for a roof in the hopes that they might be able to use it for a few other things....Just doesn't make sense to me.

Maybe Ziggy can build his open air stadium in the suburbs (Arden Hills or Brooklyn Center?) and leave the Metrodome standing for those occasional NCAA tournament games,Gopher baseball, winter truck and tractor pulls, and other events.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 4:23 PM by Fred Highlight this comment 787

Here is Lucas Oil Stadium's Event Schedule for this upcoming year: http://www.lucasoilstadium.com/calendar/loscal.asp

...if this worth an extra $200 million???

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 4:28 PM by Fred Highlight this comment 788

I suppose it's a case of "every other state or municipality has ponied up for a stadium, so why shouldn't mine?" on the part of the NFL owners in the last 20 years, but I don't fully see why more haven't followed Robert Kraft's example (and Mike's idea): Pay for the stadium yourself. Get the state to pay for supporting infrastructure. Build it in the suburbs where parking is plentiful, and shopping centers with plenty of Team merchandise available can be built. I don't get the sense Kraft is going paycheck-to-paycheck.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 5:00 PM by Expectorate Highlight this comment 789

LOL - Fred...oh my god. THAT was laughable. I had no idea that Lucas Oil Stadium was so hard up to get events there...lol. Although, I didn't see the Women's NCAA Final Four on that list, which I believe is next year. A high school prom, a rehearsal dinner, couple weddings...and a funeral directors convention highlighted that list. YIPPEEEE! Oh yeah, that'll help the maintenance budget real nice.

Mike, I hope you're right and the Vikings don't fall into a new cookie-cutter era of stadiums with your suburban plan. Heck, just look at the Pontiac Silverdome. Big suburban stadium, big parking lot, which was vacated for a new downtown one. FedEx Field in Landover, MD...I'm hearing more and more negative chatter about that place - it's too big, too far out, big parking lot and one DC politician wants to build a new one downtown.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 5:09 PM by luke Highlight this comment 790

I'm still not convinced that playing in cold weather is a distinct aadvantage in the playoffs. But if someone can produce some statistics that demonstrate a decided advantage, I'm listening, and would be willing to adjust my viewpoint on the matter.

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 7:00 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 791

Dr. X-

How's this for evidence: The # of Super Bowl appearances by teams in cold weather, open air stadiums vs the # of appearances by teams in domes/warm weather climates is 52 to 40. 13 cold weather teams have multiple Super Bowl appearances vs 6 dome/warm weather teams.

Teams with Open Air Stadiums in a hostile climate:

Steelers: 7
Patriots: 6
Broncos: 6
Redskins: 5
Packers: 4
Giants: 4
Vikings: 4
Bills: 4
Baltimore Colts: 2
Chiefs: 2
Bears: 2
Bengals: 2
Eagles: 2
Jets: 1
Ravens: 1

Total: 52 appearances, 13 teams with multiple appearances

Warm Weather/Dome Teams:

Cowboys: 8
49ers: 5
Raiders: 5
Miami: 5
Indy Colts: 2
Rams: 3
Bucs: 1
Saints: 1
Chargers: 1
Falcons 1
Titans: 1
Seahawks: 1
Panthers: 1
Cards: 1

Total: 40 appearances, 6 teams with multiple appearances
Last edited by muckand

Posted on December 22, 2010 at 9:27 PM by Fred Highlight this comment 792

Here is one more from the Vikes MNF game.

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 08:12 AM by Jared Highlight this comment 793

$200 million for a roof seems like a no-brainer to me. I've seen estimates that a city sees between $100 million and $200 million in additional spending from a Superbowl, and some cities may see as much as $100 million from a single final four. NCAA regionals can draw as much as $40 million. Just because it doesn't host massive events on a weekly basis, doesn't mean that a roof is economically unsound. It doesn't take many of these mega-events to make that $200 million seem like a small price to pay.

Obviously that amount of spending doesn't mean that amount of profit. However, it is still a significant amount of money being put back into our state's economy.

If the stadium stands for 30 years (sad to say, but that's about what I'd expect it to last), the roof will have more than paid for itself by that time.

Don't get me wrong, I had a blast at the game on Monday, and would much rather the Vikings play outside. But, it just seems illogical to turn your back on all that extra revenue for local businesses, and rely on football as the only means of a return on your significant investment.

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 08:27 AM by ajax Highlight this comment 794

OK - here's one major problem that can occur with an outdoor stadium. Found this on Paul Douglas' blog today on the Star Tribune website:

"The "Mud Bowl"? This was the scene on Wednesday at Qualcomm Stadium in San Diego. The Poinsettia Bowl game scheduled to be played later today is in doubt - not sure the pumps can get rid of the massive amounts of water on the field. If Navy does take on the San Diego State Aztecs it will be a minor miracle. Advantage Navy! (all that water, they'll know what to do....) "

Click my name for his post. He has a pic of the stadium about halfway down.

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 08:49 AM by luke Highlight this comment 795

Luke if you actually saw video, the entire area is flooded. It isn't because of a lack of a roof...it is full of water because of flooding.

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 09:47 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 796

Back in what I would call the "heyday" of the Vikings (they used to win playoff games and even go to the Superbowl), finding tickets to games late in the season was no problem, especially in the bitter cold. If you ever sat in the left field seats at the old Met when the wind was howling and the temp was near zero you know what I'm talking about.

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 10:16 AM by Ben Highlight this comment 797

I was at the game and i loved it!, sure i was cold but with more training on how to attended a late dec outdoor football game in minnesota i would have it down, there is no way they should build a roof on the new stadium, i say put it in bloomington and call it the met.. kev i loved thse old videos,, wow tailgating wet dream

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 10:16 AM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 798

Ben-

I've been going to Vikings game at the Met since the late 60's. You're right, when the team wasn't in playoff contention, it was simple to get tickets to late season games. Even in Super Bowl seasons, you could get a ticket....but I think that had more to do with the fact that the Met was AWFUL to watch football. Why? It was a baseball stadium. Anyone who went to those games will tell you that the seats, especially behind home plate were a long ways away from the field.

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 1:06 PM by Fred Highlight this comment 799

Well, yeah Pat, I understand that; but what I'm saying is, water just careens off a roof and wouldn't collapse it like 18 inches of snow did here. The point I was laboring to make was that if San Diego had a dome, they wouldn't have to worry about digging out so they can play football.

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 1:12 PM by luke Highlight this comment 800

Fred ---

I missed few, if any, playoff games in the late 60's - 70's, and attended many late season "regular" games (I mostly gave up on the Vikes when they started playing in a TV studio, and quit them altogether when owned by a car salesman and coached by another blowhard/noisy moron). The tickets were always from STH who just flat preferred to stay home when the weather turned sour. The nice thing about that deal was that it always included a pass to the Stadium Club.

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 1:27 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 801

The sid fact of the matter is the Vikings need a roofed/retractable stadium. The first home game in 29 years occured on Monday and they came 10,000 people short of filling a smaller stadium. This was with the temp in the mid 20's. Imagine in two years with an 18 game schedule that streches in to late January, no one is going to be attending those games unless the team is close to perfection. I should say no one, but the stadium would not be filled.

Minnesotans are not the hearty folks we used to be.

This combined with the Nfl's seeming want for perfect conditions for games makes an open air stadium improbable.

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 1:44 PM by Duffman Highlight this comment 802

It's a funny discussion because an outdoor stadium (beyond temporary) is a complete non-starter -- for reasons which were on vivid display last Monday night.

Likewise, a retractable is just not worth either the money or the political hassle. The Vikings will go fixed, and should.

BUT... Zygi is (apparently) something of a dim bulb on this whole process (he may be listening to an even dimmer bulb: Bagley). Right now -- I mean this afternoon (it's that urgent) -- he should be putting his financing package and political coalition in place so that it can be voted on first thing when the session opens, before anybody gets the idea that the Dome is worth saving (it is clearly not).

This is Zygi's moment to blow, and from the mumbling I've heard already, he's about to do just that.

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 3:49 PM by Rick 803

Duffman-

You don't think the fact that there was a winter storm raging during rushhour in conjunction with the fact that the Vikings COMPLETELY hosed up the ticket situation at TCF Bank Stadium had anything to do with the fact that there were 10,000 empty seats??? I wanted to go to the game, but since I wasn't already a ticket holder, there was no way I could purchase a ticket to the game and be guaranteed entry.

Build the open-air stadium. The place will sell out, even for the late season games. This is a Vikings town. I absolutely HATE the idea of another Dome being built in this town. Ziggy is right on this one.

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 4:06 PM by Fred Highlight this comment 804

For all the outdoor stadium nay-sayers, the Indians have come up with an interesting (I am not saying good necessarily) concept for use of the stadium during the long winter. Does it justify an outdoor football stadium or use of TF in a similar fashion not really but its an idea drawing people to the park. Click my name for link.

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 6:13 PM by Jared Highlight this comment 805

This is a Vikings town when the weather is nice (or the game is indoors), the beer is cold, and the games are easy to get to. Attendance and relative comfort are more closely related than many think. Take away the idiots and the drunks and what's left over, especially in poor weather?

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 6:15 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 806

Jared - I had heard about that earlier this year. I linked that report to my name.

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 6:20 PM by luke Highlight this comment 807

I have several relatives that are Packer season ticket holders and they even dislike the cold-weather games in December and January. ...Especially games against the Detroit Lions :)

Each one of them cashed out and sold their NFC Championship game tickets in January 2008 because they didn't want to go out in the cold. In all fairness, it was a terrible game time too...5:30pm CT start on a Sunday night in late January.

If there wasn't such a long waiting list for Packer season ticket holders, you would hear much more about ticket availability but the truth of the matter is most of the actual STH's sell their tickets for profits and keep retaining them year after year.

Lambeau Field pretty much sits empty for those other 355 days each year. Yes, they have tours and such throughout the year in addition to events in the Atrium, but the stadium itself is only in full use for 10 days each year.

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 6:43 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 808

Here's my question, then: how in God's name does Lambeau stay open? How on the fallen Earth does that team stay afloat, and not consider packing up the United trucks and start a mad dash for LA in the middle of the night during a snowstorm, a la Irsay's Colts darting to Indy in 1983? Yeah, I know they have public stock owners in the Packers, but good grief, what is the Packers' secret? Are they doing something that we here in Minnesota just can't figure out? How come it is that the Pack is never mentioned in any relocation speculation that springs up, or that a market SMALLER than the Twin Cities seems to be a smashing success in the NFL; and we're two weeks away from possibly seeing the final Vikings game as the Minnesota Vikings (dependent of course on the possibility of no CBA agreement, and the cancellation of the 2011 season)?

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 6:54 PM by luke Highlight this comment 809

luke, luke, luke. are you putting on a front or something? pulling our legs? please step back from the computer for a little while. open a book, watch a movie, get laid. either way, just step back from the computer and take a few breaths before you bring yourself to another "episode" and need to get out the brown paper bag again. man, you worry about a lot of random stuff.

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 7:59 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 810

While luke and I generally stand on opposite sides of the aisle, in all fairness to you Beta, i think that Luke's overall point is a good honest question. I don't know enough information about either team to know how they work and such, but i did ask myself the same question. How are the Packers able to make it work in a smaller market?

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 8:25 PM by Jared Highlight this comment 811

Allow me to be more specific. How are the Packers able to make an outdoor stadium work in a smaller market? Not that smaller market is too directly related to the functioning of an outdoor stadium considering their already large fan base across the country. Maybe that is the answer, I am just throwing stuff out there.

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 8:28 PM by Jared Highlight this comment 812

there is a easy explnation for the low turn out of the game at tcf, piss poor team, last min change in location, bad marketing and the fact that favre was not supposed to be activee traffice was brutal.. no beer and good vendors for that matter.. come on i think that and new outdoor stadium in a area round mpls will be sold out with a decent team on the field

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 9:51 PM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 813

jared - as you already mentioned making outdoor vs. indoor work has nothing to do with the size of the market a team plays in. but since you are talking about the gay bay packers specifically and why it seems to "work" in such a finite market, i guess i will indulge you (and more importantly luke) with my two cents.

it is called a "unique" situation. one, a massive scarcity of sporting options in that part of the state of wisconsin. where else are they going to go for their sporting fix? and two, being the only NFL team that the league allows (many would suggest unfairly allows) to be owned by the public at large. said another way, there WOULD NOT even be an NFL team in the city of green bay any more if they hadn't received preferential "ownership structure" treatment from the NFL back in the early 90's when the team was close to folding. when the team could have and should have been forced to fold financially like any other NFL team in a MAJOR city would have been forced to do were they in the same financial situation the pukers were. the nfl was cute and called it a "grandfather" clause to allow this one specific franchise to skirt around league ownership structure rules everyone else basically has to follow.

the green bay pukers are given a unique (and again many other owners/general public would say unfair) ownership environment by the nfl in which they are allowed to exist and operate. those are the only two reasons why keeping an NFL franchise even works in the city of green bay. the second one (i.e. the allowance by the league of their unique ownership structure) being the most influential. again, whether lambeau was indoor or outdoor doesn't have anything to do with luke's primary question in #809 which was how does a franchise work in the small city of green bay.

there you go. just saved luke a bunch of time racking his brain for the not very elusive answer. :-)

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 10:09 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 814

despite your smart-ass, FYL last sentence, thanks for the info. Honestly, I didn't even know the Pack was in danger of folding back in the 90s.

Posted on December 24, 2010 at 08:54 AM by luke Highlight this comment 815

Does anyone know the cost is to just rip the roof of the dome, and weather treat everything inside? If they do built a new stadium i really don't think it should be in burb. If it is in a burb, put it somewhere there is good public transportation!

Posted on December 24, 2010 at 09:37 AM by The Sooj Highlight this comment 816

The roof is the least of the Dome's problems. I think it is safe to say that there is no way the Vikes will play in the current Dome past 2011, roof or no roof, remodeled or complete face lift.

Posted on December 24, 2010 at 09:49 AM by clublevelfan Highlight this comment 817

That certainly is unique. I am a young guy who doesn't follow professional football any more than the product you see on the field. That kind of info I never went into so that is interesting to learn. I can certainly see how that would benefit a team in a bad financial situation, especially for the seemingly large support numbers they have. Thanks for the insight.

Posted on December 24, 2010 at 11:00 AM by Jared Highlight this comment 818

See Wikipedia for more on the ownership of the Green Bay Packers.

From a community standpoint, it's a great way to structure ownership of a team. Unfortunately, the phrases "professional sports" and "non-profit corporation" are generally not allowed within 300 feet of one another.

Posted on December 24, 2010 at 12:31 PM by Rick 819

"there is a easy explnation for the low turn out of the game at tcf, piss poor team, last min change in location, bad marketing and the fact that favre was not supposed to be activee traffice was brutal.. no beer and good vendors for that matter.. come on i think that and new outdoor stadium in a area round mpls will be sold out with a decent team on the field

Posted on December 23, 2010 at 9:51 PM by mazaratirick 813"

Well you probably think wrong. If anyone wanted to go to that game they could. Hell I even offered the extra ticket I had on this site. How does snowy weather effect the attendance level between different outdoor stadiums? By that I mean, if snow discouraged people from attending at TCF, would it not also discourage them from going to the game in say Bloomington?

The lack of alcohol was not a factor, I brought in a pop bottle of Jameson for my group and me. The guy behind us brought in a 6 pack of beer. They didn't search me at all.

The quality of the team will be a huge factor in attendance in outdoor vs indoor. The tram will have to be excellent in order to fill an outdoor stadium, especially when it is below freezing out. Not so much inside where people will go attend a mediocre team because it's warm inside.

Also when you have 20,000 people return their tickets instead going to an outdoor game that is a pretty good sign they need an indoor stadium.

Just like the Twins this is more about revenue than it is about your guys nostalgia for outdoor football. Baseball belongs outside mostly because it is played in the summer, football it doesn't matter. Football no longer has an intimate connection with the outdoors, since the NFL imposed their Dome/warm weather rules on the super bowl. Zigi wants an outdoor stadium because he thinks it will be easier to pass since it would be cheaper.

Posted on December 24, 2010 at 1:21 PM by Duffman Highlight this comment 820

Let's all try to remember that the Twins (and many, many, others - including Rick) also preferred an indoor venue, but saw the writing on the wall and switched gears on their hype/spiel. The "fans" will swallow pretty much anything they are fed - until the temp drops below 50 and the wind kicks up, etc.

Posted on December 24, 2010 at 2:09 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 821

I don't think that you can judge the pulse of the community by the turn out at the last game. In addition to all the negatives listed above, the largest deterent to attendance was the fact that you were told to arrive at least 3 hours early to maybe get a seat in the stadium. So, after fighting traffic, paying up to $40 for parking close by or parking blocks away and walking in snow, or driving to the fair grounds and taking a bus, you show up three hours before game time to find out that you get a seat in the top row, if you get a seat at all. Faced with those options - I am surprised that more than 20,000 people didn't make the decision by the required two days in advance and request a refund.

Posted on December 24, 2010 at 2:29 PM by clublevelfan Highlight this comment 822

Does anyone feel that the countdown at the top of the page seems to be draaaagggginnnnggg on just like it did last year? 104 days until we see sunshine and baseball again seems to be way too long.
Merry Christmas to everyone, hope you're all having a great holiday.

Posted on December 25, 2010 at 12:22 PM by luke Highlight this comment 823

Yeah Luke, i just posted picture of TF, with a caption, 104 days till Twins home opener vs. As! (97 days to Twins Season opener @Toronto) Merry Christmas Everyone!

Posted on December 25, 2010 at 3:12 PM by The Sooj Highlight this comment 824

Earl Santee of Populous was named the Star Tribune's 'Sportsperson of the Year.' Well earned! Can't wait for April!

Posted on December 26, 2010 at 09:01 AM by fiesta Highlight this comment 825

well duffman must be a genius, he has it all figured out...this would never work! lets see , a brabd new stadium that has all the amenities that can help during cold weather games... TF is better equppied to host a cold weather baseball game (fan wise and field wise) than TCF. i snuck in a pint... but do you think 60k people want to have to sneak in beer and booze? it is a inconvenance if you ask me.. and a new staium would have bars and resturants and other places for fans to enjoy the gamr, TCF is cold everywhere but that bathrooms.. I only went to the game cuz it WAS outside.. maybe you could not give away your ticket cuz you are to critical and always think you have it all figured out.. i would not want to go to a game with you either.. insert spelling jokes here!

Posted on December 26, 2010 at 2:42 PM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 826

Further proof we still need a fixed (not Teflon-coated fiberglass) roof here - even AWAY from Minnesota, outdoor Vikings games get postponed. Enter the Vikes-Eagles game, in an outdoor stadium in Philly, postponed til Tuesday cause of snow.

Posted on December 26, 2010 at 5:28 PM by luke Highlight this comment 827

Merry Christmas to all the BPM faithful. Winters seem alot longer now that I can't wait for outdoor baseball to begin again. (or maybe it's because here in SE Minnesota, we set a record for ANY month snowfall total, according to KTTC in Rochester) Opening day can't come soon enough!

Great article in the Strib on Earl Santee made me close my eyes and I could almost feel the sun on my face, hear the crack of the bat, and taste my beer and brat. Let's hope the next 100 days go quickly - not to wish my life away.

Posted on December 26, 2010 at 7:40 PM by ole Highlight this comment 828

no luke, the weather on the east coast is not further proof that MN needs a fixed-roof on their stadium. Did you graduate high school with that logic?

Posted on December 27, 2010 at 11:47 AM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 829

No Kev, the LOGIC is, that even in an open-air stadium (which Zygi apparently wants), and when it involves The Purple, apparently games STILL get snowed out. Just with a fixed steel roof (a la St. Louis), the game probably still would have gone ahead.
Although, hell knows why they cancelled the game and moved it to tomorrow night. Philly only got just under 5 inches of snow out of the whole thing.

Posted on December 27, 2010 at 12:43 PM by luke Highlight this comment 830

Favre Conspiracy!

Posted on December 27, 2010 at 12:54 PM by TK Highlight this comment 831

How many snow-outs have they had in Philly Luke??? Enough to justify $200 million for a roof? NO! The snow out had nothing to do with the stadium, field. It was a public safety issue. Philadelphia is not Minneapolis. They have WAY more people and not nearly the same amount of equipment for handling a major storm like this. Cars, trains, buses can't move on the east coast during a major snow storm. They don't need a roof over Lincoln Financial field, and they don't need one over the Vikings new stadium either. In fact the postponement of the Vikings game had to do with a shitty roof caving in. Shut up and play!

Posted on December 27, 2010 at 12:54 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 832

I agree TK. Seriously, though Kevin...don't you find it just a little pissy that the Vikings STILL get snowed out and postponed, "no matter where they roam" as the Four Horsemen (aka Metallica) once sang?
Look at Detroit, if Detroit gets a 700,000 gallon snowfall next week, the game will still go on, because they have a fixed roof. No roof collapse, cancellation, no postponement, 400 people don't have to bring shovels to dig out Ford Field. The Vikings curse will certainly end next week, no matter what the weather is like in Detroit.

Of course, the Vikings won't have to worry about it next year. It's always sunny in Los Angeles.

If the Vikings had noticed the writing on the wall eight years ago, and done what the MSFC SHOULD HAVE done and was RECOMMENDED to do, none of this would have ever happened. Minnesota has an uncanny knack for taking action only after disaster strikes, and not heeding warnings and doing something about it BEFORE disaster hits, instead we wait too long, let disaster strike, then pay lots more money to fix the current problem.

And besides, the NCAA really frowns on snow falling INSIDE the stadium, breaking seats and roof panels tearing wide open whilst the Final Four is going on. Seriously. Snow does a lot more damage to a hardwood basketball floor than SportTurf. What the hell, just take a couple ceilings off airplane hangars at MSP and affix them to the top facing of the new place.

Posted on December 27, 2010 at 1:22 PM by luke Highlight this comment 833

seriously luke, when your buddies told you to go play in traffic, you really shouldn't have.

Posted on December 27, 2010 at 1:29 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 834

If Detroit gets 700,000 gallons of snow, I am sure as hell there would be no game, no would there be anyone left alive in that city...

Posted on December 27, 2010 at 1:49 PM by TK Highlight this comment 835

It's just a fitting way for the calendar year 2010 to end for the Minnesota Vikings...it all started back in January with the 12 men on the field penalty. The Sidney Rice fiasco, Favre circus, Randy Moss circus, Brad Childress, Dome collapse, Miami choke in week 2, Detroit "home game", TCF Bank Stadium...

Posted on December 27, 2010 at 2:02 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 836

forgot to mention all of the Percy Harvin migraine troubles along with the many other injuries the team has faced this year.

Randy Moss was sure worth that 3rd round draft pick too...

Posted on December 27, 2010 at 2:03 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 837

Has everyone heard about the promotion the St. Paul Saints are planning for next summer? Metrodome whoopee cushions in honor of the 30th anniversary of the inflation of the dome and its subsequent 2010 deflation.

Posted on December 27, 2010 at 4:03 PM by terry Highlight this comment 838

Make sure you get one of those for Kev in AZ...lol. Maybe five or six of them.
And, instead of the usual "Take me out to the ballgame", all 6,157 people at Midway that day will be asked to stand up, blow up their whoopee cushion and sit down simultaneously.
The 7th Inning Stretch promotion will be called "The Biggest Damn Fart in Support of a new Fixed-Roof Stadium for the Vikings"

Posted on December 27, 2010 at 9:48 PM by luke Highlight this comment 839

luke my man - take a break for the next couple plays and catch your breath. get a drink of gatorade, talk with your position coach and we'll see if we can get you back out there in time for the win.

wow..........just......wow.

Posted on December 27, 2010 at 11:33 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 840

The state should build a huge biosphere!

Large enough to hold an 18 hole golf course, open air stadiums, amusement park, shopping center, water park, aquarium, zoo, fishing pond, restaurants, bars, gardens, hiking trails, etc.

There would be a huge underground parking area, a mass transit hub and helicopter landing pads.

Posted on December 28, 2010 at 4:37 PM by dave Highlight this comment 841

lol dave. now you're talking :).
Oh beta, beta, beta...TAKE A JOKE. geez.
As I was writing that comment, I couldn't stop laughing. I even tell jokes that make ME laugh. lighten up!
Seriously step back, just imagine 6,157 people sitting on whoopee cushions, simultaneously.
The imagery is priceless.

Posted on December 28, 2010 at 4:47 PM by luke Highlight this comment 842

Luke,

Did you live under power lines as a kid!!!

Posted on December 28, 2010 at 5:09 PM by firedog Highlight this comment 843

Luke, if you ever type out a joke and find yourself laughing at it, please hit the backspace button and shut down your computer.

Posted on December 28, 2010 at 5:27 PM by TK Highlight this comment 844

Am I the only person having trouble connecting to this page and posting on this page?

Posted on December 28, 2010 at 6:31 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 845

firedog - no. But, there was that one incident....
I still can't believe you hard noses can't find the humor in the whoopee cushion joke. I thought for sure Kevin in AZ would at least have given me a :), if not an LOL at it...he's given me so many jabs over the last three years.

Incidentally, weren't we arguing about fixed-roof vs. retractable roof vs. open-air vs. moving to Los Angeles??

Posted on December 28, 2010 at 6:36 PM by luke Highlight this comment 846

I had more to say but nixed that in favor of this: Luke. Stop. Step away from the site for a week and come back when you have something logical to say.

Posted on December 28, 2010 at 8:32 PM by Jared Highlight this comment 847

Seriously though, Dr. X - I had problems getting to the site last week.

Posted on December 28, 2010 at 9:05 PM by luke Highlight this comment 848

Yeah, I'm running a total system scan aas I write this just in case it wwas something on my end. I'm posting just to see if it posts.

Posted on December 28, 2010 at 9:13 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 849

Dr. X,

"I'm posting just to see if it posts." Luke has been doing that for a couple years...

Posted on December 28, 2010 at 10:55 PM by TK Highlight this comment 850

Logical??? Whoa! If that becomes a criteria for posting here there will be no one left save for TTH and myself - and I'm not so sure about him.

Posted on December 28, 2010 at 11:56 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 851

Ummm...

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 06:08 AM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 852

lol Ben.

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 06:44 AM by luke Highlight this comment 853

You should not be having any further troubles after the traumas of the past couple of weeks. The hosting company had a series of server failures, and finally decided to move a bunch of sites -- including this one -- to more stable climes. That move was not very smooth, to say the least.

If you're still having problems this week, please let me know by email (rick at you know what).

As for logic, it's an unfortunately rare force out here in the real world.

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 10:11 AM by Rick 854

Dr. X -- I have been having a lot of troubles posting and viewing this site as well. I keep getting http errors and I have tried both Firefox and IE numerous times.

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 09:57 AM by Mike Highlight this comment 855

By the way, Mike, your post got flagged for moderation only because it contained a common spammer word: "http".

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 10:18 AM by Rick 856

Soon it will be exactly 100 days until Home Opening Day.

Just stating the obvious.

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 10:27 AM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 857

Luke you need to find something to do. Look up Joanie, maybe she'll be willing to have a 3-way with you and your new girlfriend. That should keep you away from the computer for a little while.

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 1:30 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 858

Metrodome roof won't be fixed until March. Where does Twinsfest move to?

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 2:57 PM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 859

PatMeares,

I thought I read somewhere it was going to be held at Ford Field?

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 4:11 PM by tk Highlight this comment 860

I think that even March is optimistic. Fact is, I'm having trouble imagining it EVER being reinflated.

Haven't heard much about the NFL lockout lately, but it has to be considered a factor.

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 5:09 PM by Rick 861

man, Kev, still can't spell the girl's name right, lol.

I read that in the Business Journal this afternoon, Pat. Thank God the Twins wiped that place out of memory last season. Logistically, the Metrodome works very well for TwinsFest, and from what I've heard from some on here, they've tried other places (i.e. the convention center and MOA) and they were colossal disasters. I'd be interested to hear what the Twins will do.

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 5:23 PM by luke Highlight this comment 862

Again Luke, you're being logical, you would be interested in what the Twins would do?

I would certainly hope you would be interested in what they would do rather than trying to listen to others who are speculating.

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 5:37 PM by tk Highlight this comment 863

Minneapolis Armory, perhaps?

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 5:55 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 864

Not that far from the Metrodome, so folks could hop off the light rail and stroll a few blocks. Place ain't too big, either; maybe just right.

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 5:56 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 865

Hey, don't blame me tk, Pat was the one that asked "Where does TwinsFest move to?" lol.
But, it IS a fair question, given the folks that have purchased advance tickets (I am not one of them incidentally), which if memory serves correctly, went on sale BEFORE the Dome caved in.
So, I'm logical. Pat introduced the question :).

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 6:15 PM by luke Highlight this comment 866

Vikes will get a new stadium this legislative session and they will build on dome site and play at TCF for 2 years. Just my shot in the dark prediction. It's funny watching the Vikes game last night they said the Vikings had 2 home games postponed and they play in a dome and the Twins had 1 game postponed and they play outside.

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 6:48 PM by firedog Highlight this comment 867

Twinsfest in St.Cloud...possibly.

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 7:22 PM by Steve Highlight this comment 868

I just skip any post from luke...

i really did enjoy twinsfest at the dome... so this is gonna take some getting used to..

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 8:37 PM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 869

Target Center?

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 10:38 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 870

Twins are expected to make the announcement tomorrow regarding the new location for 2011 Twinsfest.

Posted on December 29, 2010 at 11:32 PM by Max Highlight this comment 871

Luke...Check out all of these Vikings fans freezing and literally dying since there's no roof. There's absolutely no crowd noise is there? What a lousy homefield advantage we once had. Incidentally this was the last year the Vikes went to the superbowl. Oh how I wish Vin Scully still called NFL games on TV.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 12:35 AM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 872

Does anyone have pictures or know where I can see some updates on the new construction down at the ballpark? I thought the construction for the improvements started a few weeks ago yet I haven't seen anything about it anywhere.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 12:37 AM by ML Highlight this comment 873

oh, to long for the days of yore...when things were simpler.
It sure looked sunny as hell in that video kev. Funny still, I didn't see a drop of snow, or a snow pile, or even a hint of snow anywhere on the field. When was that game supposedly?

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 06:50 AM by luke Highlight this comment 874

My guess would be mid-late December 1973 or 1976. Brent McClanahan (33) seemed to do most of the ball carrying early. While Bud Grant was known for not starting rookies, Chuck Foreman's talent forced Grant to make an exception. But Foreman entered the league in '73, so it could be either one of those years. Perhaps someone with a better memory than me can devine more clues from the footage.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 08:09 AM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 875

Well, if you look at the top of the clip, you'll see it's from 1976. Then the notes below state the date is December 18, 1976. I think it's funny that on the first long run by McClanahan, Ken Houston tackles him WAAYY out of bounds. But no flag, no uproar from Vikes, not even a mention by the announcers. Funny how the game has changed.

And my guess is TwinsFest will be moved to the National Sports Center. It's where they already do their winter Twins Training Academy, so there's a relationship. Plus tons of free parking.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 08:35 AM by Faber College Alum Highlight this comment 876

Very sad news today for Twins fans...in particular, one of the greatest Twins ever....lets keep Harmon Killebrew and his family in our thoughts and prayers as he battles this cancer.

He is arguably my favorite Twins player all-time and such a class act in every aspect.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 09:26 AM by Mike Highlight this comment 877

Very sad news indeed.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 12:09 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 878

Sitting in my batter's eye seats, it was a gorgeous day - somewhere in the 50's. What a difference a week makes because the following Sunday it was still sunny but in the teens as we played the Rams for the NFC title.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 12:36 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 879

Were you stuck behind the flagpole?

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 2:28 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 880

Dr. X,

No I was in front of and to the right of the flagpole (as seated).

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 2:57 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 881


"TwinsFest moved to National Sports Center in Blaine, MN"

Might as well have moved it to Egypt.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 3:08 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 882

Wow, what an unfortunate choice of venue. I'm sure their options were limited but...wow. It's not even on a freeway. Most people have no clue where it is. Are they going to use the arena?

Could be that they just decided to punt.

Very weird, bad choice.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 3:44 PM by Rick 883

Yeah I would say the chances now that I go to Twinsfest are slim. I've got tickets already for free but I don't want to go to Blaine...for anything.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 4:09 PM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 884

Wow, looks like it is going to be reminiscent of my youth going to a Card Show.

I do not see traffic issues there, as there have been more people in attendance for an opening games of the USA Cup. I mean, heck, who is really going to show up? I wonder if they are going to charge for parking, as a way to generate lost revenue? I doubt they will, but gets me wondering.

Well, just think, the Anoka or the Vikings had once proposed ideas of having a stadium out that way...

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 4:32 PM by tk Highlight this comment 885

In case no one else saw the short piece from Kevin Smith on WCCO news at noon he said they're going to think of Twinsfest entirely different than the dome version they've always had.

Something about him just rubs me the wrong way.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 5:01 PM by jcoplanj@yahoo.com Highlight this comment 886

Hold the phone, folks. Faber said it was his guess that Twinsfest would end up in Blaine. Has this been made official?

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 5:34 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 887

Hey Rick, I've been wondering about the top of this page. Is the change from daylight to stars tied to specific, reegular times, or the NWS sunrise and sunset times?

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 5:36 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 888

Dr. X ---

Note the quotation marks --- yes, official word sent to STH.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 5:45 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 889

After attending TwinsFest last January, I wrote on this site (sorry, can't find the article right now) that the event was overdue for a reboot. If this change of venue results in that, it will be a Very Good Thing.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 5:47 PM by Rick 890

So does the ncs have a dome over the main field? Is that's the case it's not a big deal since there will be enough room, if not it will be a little weird. As for location it is not hard to get to at all so if you do not know where it's at get a map and figure it out. Blaine hosts the Golf tourney and USA cup every year which deals with more people than twinsfest will bring in so traffic should no big deal.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 5:49 PM by Duffman Highlight this comment 891

Dr. X,

There are three "themes" for this site: day, night, and dusk. You can select among them at the top of the page.

If you choose "Auto" (the default) then the themes are applied according to actual sunrise and sunset times. It was a complicated little program to research and write, but fun.

My original goal was to let others create and submit additional themes, just for fun. Maybe this spring...

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 7:30 PM by Rick 892

From the STH mailing:

"The Twins announced today that due to ongoing repair issues with the Metrodome, TwinsFest 2011 has been moved to the National Sports Center in Blaine, Minn. TwinsFest remains scheduled for January 28-30, 2011.

Due to the move to a smaller venue, TwinsFest tickets will be limited in comparison to recent years. With that limited availability in mind, Season Ticket Holders are encouraged to act quickly to secure their complimentary tickets if you haven't already done so, as the event is expected to sell out in the near future. The opportunity to order your complimentary TwinsFest tickets is available until 5 PM CT on Wednesday, January 5th. If you have already secured your complimentary TwinsFest tickets you do not need to take any further action as those tickets will be honored at the new location the National Sports Center. "

So much for going to TwinsFest this year.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 8:37 PM by jfh Highlight this comment 893

Rick - I remember that post well, it was "A Whiff of Baseball" dated late last January (click my name for the post).
I do agree with your assertion that TwinsFest needs a little bit of a makeover. That "Down Memory Lane" sign has been at TwinsFest's since its inception in 1989.
While TwinsFest certainly gets me in the mood for baseball in late January, even before the Big Dump relegated the Dome to a concrete hole without cabin pressure, I had planned to skip it because it's just the same stuff, and not worth another $9 admission price.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 9:39 PM by luke Highlight this comment 894

I've been to Twinsfest twice a long time ago. Unless you were willing to stand in endless lines for autographs or clubhouse tours, it was little more than a card and memorabilia show. Is it any different today?

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 10:14 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 895

No it isn't. I believe it once held the distinction of the largest card and memorabilia show in the Midwest. Not sure if that's still true. But 30,000+ still go every year, with the exception of next year.

I never had any desire to stand in line to wait for an autograph, or a clubhouse tour. However, I did win an autographed Bob Feller bobblehead last year, and I only had to plop down $2 to spin the wheel. The attendant at the booth told me that those bobbleheads sell for $50 at the Feller museum.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 10:37 PM by luke Highlight this comment 896

The "Down Memory Lane" section, I believe, is where Clyde Doepner has his usual display of memorabilia - which is one of the few things that does change from year to year and is, in my opinion, well worth the effort to view.

Posted on December 30, 2010 at 11:34 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 897

i like twinsfest, but i dont get autographs, stand in line or anything, just like to walk around, bump into local sports celbs or what not, hall of fame plaqes and all kinds of stuff.. i get the STH comps so i will still go this year but if not would prob not pay 9 bucks to go to blaine... they seariously could not have gotten target center? on a weekend the wolves are losing there?

Posted on December 31, 2010 at 01:15 AM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 898

Heck, The Wolves would welcome in the fans, it would be there largest crowd of the season!

Posted on December 31, 2010 at 01:51 AM by TK Highlight this comment 899

Gee --- you don't suppose the Twins picked out the cheapest alternative they could find?

Posted on December 31, 2010 at 09:27 AM by Ben Highlight this comment 900

kev in az - great video as usual. are those yours or just stuff you have found out on youtube?

p.s. i want one of those 1976 ford ltd II's and one of those plaid sport coats the guy was wearing in the commercial. now that sir, is CLASS!

Posted on December 31, 2010 at 11:58 AM by Betaband Highlight this comment 901

oh btw. blaine?? you would think the two shlubs kevin smith and dave st. peter (maybe it is just me, but there is something fishy that i just don't like about these two guys) could at least find a space for twins fest in hennepin county. it is the good people of minneapolis and hennepin county paying for our ballpark afterall. idk, at least throw them a bone and have the event somewhere within the city/county paying for your playpen and not way out in anoka county.

Posted on December 31, 2010 at 12:03 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 902

Please Beta in all your wisdom tell us where in hennipen county should they have it? The convention center is booked, and target center is too small, plus there is a Twolves game there that weekend.

Ps Minneapolis didn't pay a dime for that stadium. They are just reaping the benefits from it.

Posted on December 31, 2010 at 2:18 PM by Duffman Highlight this comment 903

With the Legends Club and Metropolitan Club added together I would bet that there is close to the same square footage as the NSC. Maybe there was already a wedding booked?

Posted on December 31, 2010 at 3:15 PM by clublevelfan Highlight this comment 904

It would be nice to have TF at TF, but it would be so tough to have some flow to the set-up.

Happy New Year everyone, 2010 was a great year for outdoor baseball to return to Minnesota. Here's to a better 2011!

Posted on December 31, 2010 at 5:08 PM by TK Highlight this comment 905

there are other convention type centers or large indoor facilities within hennepin county. last i checked, twins fest is mainly nothing more than a glorified baseball card trade show and autograph session, so the event itself definitely doesn't need as much space as the twins like to imply mainly for "marketing" purposes.

minneapolis didn't/hasn't paid a dime for the stadium? are you really as clueless as you came off in that statement? last i checked the largest city in hennepin county IS MINNEAPOLIS. so yes, they are certainly paying their share. minneapolis also pays in wear & tear on city streets, sidewalks, transit systems, city infrastructure, congestion, pollution, trash removal, littering, police overtime, traffic management costs, etc. of having millions of fans trapsing into (and usually by car) the city all season long.

sure there is an economic benefit to having the stadium in the city proper, but don't please don't sheepishly imply there is nothing more than pure benefit and no cost to the city by having it located there.

don't get me wrong, i am glad the stadium is in minneapolis. it belongs in minneapolis. and i am sure the city doesn't mind it being there. but don't imply it doesn't cost the city anything having it there and that they are just some random entity reaping fortune off its back.

we are out of here for the night. happy new year to all!

Posted on December 31, 2010 at 5:30 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 906

Happy new year to all. May 2011 be everything you wish it to be. (Now is a real good time to make that wish.)

Posted on January 1, 2011 at 12:11 AM by Rick 907

And the same to you and all "posters". And thanks much for providing this site.

Posted on January 1, 2011 at 12:55 AM by robin Highlight this comment 908

In my mind, I'm picturing a "2011" logo, except with Minny and Paul replacing the ones.

Here's to a better season than 2010. Work out a few kinks in our lovely ballpark, win a few post season games, watch Thome hit #600 (/fingers crossed/).

Happy New Year, baseball fans. :-)

Posted on January 1, 2011 at 08:53 AM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 909

Ben, I don't know if the Twins found the cheapest alternative, but perhaps maybe the only realistic alternative on short notice. The NSC indoor sports hall is 58,000 sq ft. and the Schwan Center has an additional 15,000 sq ft (granted some of it is small conference rooms, etc.) and the event still has to be cut down in scale. There aren't that many 60,000 sq ft. plus facilities in the Twin Cities that are also available in four weeks notice. That's why other events that were booked at the dome are just being cancelled, like that home improvement expo. The NSC is having to totally rearrange their weekend soccer leagues for the event as it is.

Beta, where in Hennepin County could they have hosted it? Please name the "other convention type centers or large indoor facilities within hennepin county." Name one that has over 60,000 sq ft of space THAT WAS NOT ALREADY BOOKED.

Posted on January 1, 2011 at 11:08 AM by Faber College Alum Highlight this comment 910

faber - i have a few different ones. but here is a "fun" one for you that i know would work since twinsfest is over a weekend. and it is almost smack dab in the middle of hennepin county.......twins partner best buy. their world headquarters facility in richfield has a couple hundred thousand extra square feet available within their world headquarters that could handle an event like this. the 4 tower facility and central hub area itself is something like 1.2 million square feet. they also have a giant theatre, multiple giant conference rooms, a multi-level massive covered parking garage that can hold thousands of cars, thousands more parking spaces outside, access to 494 & penn ave for transit.

they host several non-best buy events, fundraisers, etc. there every year and i know it would work for something like twinsfest......my good friend works there and i have been inside several times.

Posted on January 2, 2011 at 01:49 AM by Betaband Highlight this comment 911

Hey why not Brookdale Mall theres hardly anything left in it now. Theres probably more than enough space for something like Twins Fest maybe?

Posted on January 2, 2011 at 04:14 AM by Leroy Highlight this comment 912

Sorry to we the Badgers get beat in Pasedena Saturday. That crowd was really reed. I guess when you go to a presigious bowl in a beautiful location, the fans will follow.
I sure hope Jerry Kill is the right man for the Minnesota job, half a century between Rose Bowl appearances is waaay too long.

Posted on January 2, 2011 at 07:45 AM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 913

Sorry about the typos, it's early in the morning.

Posted on January 2, 2011 at 07:46 AM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 914

Beta, interesting space idea. Has Best Buy ever done "trade" show type events, you know, with vendor booths, etc.?

Posted on January 2, 2011 at 07:54 AM by Faber College Alum Highlight this comment 915

faber - my understaning is they have.

p.s. what?? never sorry to see becky badger and her overweight boorish fans get cheese hardened hearts broken. tcu was the better team. nice work frogs!

Posted on January 2, 2011 at 11:19 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 916

C'mon, you got to show your neighbors to the east a little love. They might even tell us how they manaage to get to Pasedena once or twice in a lifetime.

Posted on January 3, 2011 at 05:46 AM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 917

1. TwinsFest in Blaine. Why is anybody raising a stink about this? It's a non-ideal, short-term fix. Get over it.

2. The problem with the 2010 Vikings? The same problem with the Vikings every year: no stability/talent in the front office. We all rah-rah about Childress being gone, but Chilly was not the top banana. It goes higher than that. Until that is resolved, expect to see the same amount of Super Bowl championship banners hanging from the rafters at the Metrodo-, err, TCF Stadi-uh, Blaine High School's football field.

3. Gopher fans need to get over the complex they've built up about Badger fans. I guess when you bring nothing to the table the only thing you can do is knock the tableware off of it. Success in sports in cyclical. Once upon a time the Gophers were better than the Badgers in football, basketball, hockey, (insert any other sport here). It will happen again. Betaband might be in a nursing home by then, but it will happen again. (In the interest of full disclosure, I'm a UW-Madison grad born and raised in Minny. The Becky Badger jokes stopped being funny when Luke stopped being funny.)

Posted on January 3, 2011 at 09:17 AM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 918

"Becky Badger" jokes from Minnesota fans are just as bad as "Viqueens" jokes by Packer fans...they are both lame

I agree, Blaine is a short-term fix for this year's Twinsfest and its really no big deal. It will be interesting where they will hold the event in 2012 and beyond, but I am sure the days of Twinsfest at the Metrodome are now over.

The problem with Childress was how he brought in Brett Favre and let Brett run the team. Sending 3 team leaders to Mississippi to lure Favre in August than having his assistant coaches lie about their absences from practice?? I am sure that caused some turmoil in the locker room whether you want to believe it or not.

The Vikings are definitely in rebuilding mode now...lots of veteran players will be let go. The modern NFL is very cyclical and most teams only have a 3-year window to be highly competitive before you need to rebuild. It's just too bad they gave up their 3rd round draft pick (66th overall) for Randy Moss...another desperate Childress move. And yes, aside from ownership, it ultimately came down to Childress as he had the final authority over the 53 man roster.

I think Rick Spielman has done a great job with scouting and drafting players and I hope they promote him to GM and let Leslie Frazier take care of the coaching. It gets to be too much for a head coach to both coach effectively at such a high level and make personnel decisions in my opinion.

Anyways....only SIX weeks until pitchers and catchers report to Fort Myers!

Posted on January 3, 2011 at 10:41 AM by Mike Highlight this comment 919

Jeez....some of you are acting as if Blaine is in Timbuktu. It's only 15 minutes from Downtown Mpls for cryin' out loud.

"Way out in Anoka County"????? Really?

Posted on January 3, 2011 at 11:20 AM by Fred Highlight this comment 920

Blaine's fine. It's close enough. I'm sure the Twins also wanted a sports-focused facility, with high ceilings where the kids can hit wiffle balls, etc. Other sites might not offer that kind of space. I just hope that they don't try to cram too many fans in there. 3/4 of the fans in 1/2 the space won't be much fun.

Posted on January 3, 2011 at 2:58 PM by BR Highlight this comment 921

dr. x - nope. never. and contrary to what some becky grads would like to have you think most of their fans act just as spiteful towards minny fans as most of us do towards them. that "no love loss" relationship between the fan bases will never change.....ever.

to the other cheap shot. and perhaps we can instruct becky badger on how to finally win a national championship in football at least once every.....oh i don't know......120 years or so. just win one NC in football becky badger.......JUST ONE. since 1889 and counting.

i will take 6 program national championships over a couple random, non national championship trips to the rose bowl any day.

okay.......sorry......rant over.........college football is my first love......so i get a little emotional. ;-)

Posted on January 3, 2011 at 3:32 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 922

It's OK Beta. I'd be very emotional if I was a Gopher athletics fan too. In fact, I'd be crying every day.

Posted on January 3, 2011 at 3:38 PM by The Truth Hurts Highlight this comment 923

Check out IIHF World Junior US/Canaduh semi tonight at 6:30p. If I'm not mistaken, at some point tonight, a Badger will take a pass from a Gopher, who received a pass from a Fighting Sioux...

God forbid if the string of passes started with a wolverine.

Posted on January 3, 2011 at 4:02 PM by N.D. (aka N.D. "Rube") Highlight this comment 924

NHL Network, btw.

Posted on January 3, 2011 at 4:03 PM by N.D. (aka N.D. "Rube") Highlight this comment 925

6 National Championships with the last being in 1960? (in which year they were 8-2) Very different now...it's like claiming basketball titles before the NCAA Tournament kicked in--they aren't the same.

Posted on January 3, 2011 at 4:07 PM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 926

I've had some great visits to Madison to watch Gopher / Badger matches, back when I followed the women's volleyball team more closely than I do now.

I had no problems at all wearing my maroon and gold, and sitting in the cheap seats surrounded by Badger fans. It was a great time, there were some ribbing, but at the end we all enjoyed the matches.

Now, I think the average volleyball fan isn't quite as 'fanatic' as the average football fan, but I've had similar experiences at Colorado College and St. Cloud State for men's hockey games. People react to you in the way you lead them to react.

My favorite was a CC game, where the student section was just a riot to watch - they were going at it all game long. Cheers, 'skits', songs, everything. On the way out, I managed to step up next to one of the chief 'instigators', and I told him "You CC folks need to learn how to have some fun at games..." His eyes got huge, he looked at me, saw my 'Minnesota' sweatshirt, and we both laughed. It was great.

Posted on January 3, 2011 at 5:37 PM by F_T_K Highlight this comment 927

Beta,
I'm old enough to be your father, and even I don't remember the Gophers' last National Championship or their last Rose Bowl appearance (Which was 1963, I believe). At some point, those ancient championships get too old to count. What do they mean to you if you weren't around to enjoy them? We all laugh at Cubs fans rooting for a team that hasn't won a WS in 100 years. This has been half as long, but still, it's been over five decades, four wars, eleven presidents, and a space program that started out sending tiny satellites into low orbit to leaving tire tracks on Mars since the Gophers won a National Championship. At least Badgers fans who travel with their team have been able to go to Southern California a couple times, while Gophers fans have had Nashville, El Paso, and Tempe for bowl destinations. I'd much rather go to SoCal, wouldn't you?

Surely you've heard the phrase, "What have you done for me lately?

Posted on January 3, 2011 at 8:55 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 928

ha! please! only a couple becky badger apologists with ZERO NC's to their program's name or just plain minnesota golden gopher athletics haters would completely discard 6 AP national championships as "not really counting anymore" because of the year they were achieved. give me a freakin' break!

media "name" school michigan didn't win a national title in football between 1947 and 1997....50 years! that amount of time sound familiar dr. x? and during that time do you think meatchicken fans, the school, the media stopped taking and giving them credit for their 1947 national championship and their NC's prior to 1947 just because of the 50 year break in between? or because as dr. x cluelessly said: "well i wasn't there for it in 1947, so i guess it just doesn't count anymore for the program. it is no longer part of history. take that one off and all others before it! now!".

again, would much rather have a 50 year break AND the 6 national titles than a 102 year break (cubs) or an entire 121 year history (becky badger) with absolutely ZERO national championships to my name.

to bring it back to the usual topic of this board: so dr. x based on your rather silly (and typically curmudgeonly) logic you should also be saying the minnesota twins trip to the world series in 1965 and the corresponding AL pennant (one of only three they have) should be taken down from target field and disregarded as well. i mean 1965.....that is just as far back as the gophers rose bowl trips. i mean anything in 1965 or 1960 or 1963 or 1962......you know just shouldn't count anymore. i mean were people still living in caves back then? horse and buggy? i trust you will take up a campaign next season to make sure the travesty and injustice of counting that 1965 AL pennant and flying that 1965 AL flag at target field are rectified. i mean it just doesn't count anymore, so it is so wrong. it is ancient history. the minnesota twins...AL champions twice (1987 & 1991. 1965 redacted).

please get a clue.

Posted on January 3, 2011 at 11:49 PM by Betaband Highlight this comment 929

It never phases to amaze me how this board turns into a flame fest for about a week with topics randomly discussed on this board. I wish I had time to track all the different flaming from Luke's girl,politics, football, and other non-sense.

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 01:12 AM by TK Highlight this comment 930

Boy oh boy, Beta, I try to be civil and nice to you and you still come off as an abrassive a**hole. I guess I'm not old enough to be your father, I must be old enough to be your grandfather. Remember the old adage, "You get catch more flies with honey than you can with vinegar."

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 05:39 AM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 931

*passes out the weed*

Can't we all just get along????

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 09:25 AM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 932

Here's your explanation:

The last Twins game was 87 days ago.
The next Twins game will be in 87 days.

Today is the darkest day of the year -- the winter solstice, if you will -- for baseball fans.

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 09:39 AM by Rick 933

And the weather is freezing...even down here. That's enough to make anyone cranky.

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 09:42 AM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 934

While I respect what they accomplished, going 8-2 in 1960 and losing the Rose Bowl shouldn't be something to hang your hat on 50 years later. The BCS may be flawed, but those ancient "National Championships" are nothing too amazing.

The same argument may be made in 20 years once a working football playoff system is in place for all of the champions from the last 10 years or so.

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 10:55 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 935

I just want to thank the Big Ten football programs for proving me right about how much their conference sucks.

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 12:36 PM by Duffman Highlight this comment 936

Does Bert Blyleven join the Hall of Fame tomorrow?

Let's hope this is the year! Blyleven in 2011!

The Winter Caravan schedule was also announced today. Nice to see Valencia, Revere and Span out on the tour.

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 12:46 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 937

You know, with Jesse Crain gone, Bert's number (28) is available for retirement. Another circle would look great up there on the admin building.

Assuming he's elected (which seems to be the conventional wisdom out there, though we certainly don't want to count any chickens just yet), I'm not sure where they'll put his gate! He'd go between Hrbek (14) and Carew (29), but the only opening there is the vendor entrance on Seventh street. Not very glamorous. Maybe something creative with Carew's gate.

As you probably know, there is one as-yet-unnumbered gate, used mostly by smokers during games. But it's between Oliva (6) and Hrbek (14). Wonder who that one might work for...

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 1:07 PM by Rick 938

The most appropriate thing for them to do may be to re-name the strip club from the 10th inning to Gate 28.

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 1:20 PM by Duffman Highlight this comment 939

The smoker gate became for pre-game participants only or something like that about halfway through the season. It used to be my prime secret gate with no line.

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 1:24 PM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 940

Perhaps they should name a bathroom after Bert. He is THE walking, talking fart machine!

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 1:27 PM by kevin in az Highlight this comment 941

Don't need a bathroom for farts - unless they have lumps.

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 1:46 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 942

I use that smoker gate for most games. Quickest way up to my seats. I'd be down with that being Bert's gate. When it comes time for Baby Jesus to have his own gate, he will be deserving of a new special, most important one to date gate. You'll see.

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 1:54 PM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 943

By that time the team will be looking to bilk the taxpayers out of another new stadium --- with a retractable roof.

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 2:12 PM by Ben Highlight this comment 944

The skyway is between gate 14 and 29. Haha.

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 3:54 PM by bobby Highlight this comment 945

The skyway would be appropriate for all of the homeruns hit off of Blyleven into the "sky"...or maybe Brad Radke someday as his #22 would fit well there too...

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 4:03 PM by Mike Highlight this comment 946

The MLB Network is running 1 hour shows discussing the 20 greatest games of all time every monday night. Think both 163 of 2009 and game 7 of the 92 Series make it?

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 4:17 PM by PNB19 Highlight this comment 947

PNB19,

I am guessing you meant Game 7 of '91 :) Toronto didn't need 7 games to beat the Braves in '92...

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 5:07 PM by tk Highlight this comment 948

tk - was the 92 Series the one the Blue Jays won with the Carter walk-off homer, or was that 1993?? Brain freese....

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 6:54 PM by luke Highlight this comment 949

They could name the smoking gate after Juan Berringuer (sp?). Since he's not in The Hall, they don't need to use his number. Just call it the "Senor Smoking Gate."

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 7:13 PM by Dr. X Highlight this comment 950

Just booked my flight and room for spring training! tomorrow the STH pre sale for tix (spring training)going to 3/10 & 3/11 games..staying not to far at the crown plaza , what else is there to do in ft myers? not renting a car... last time i was there i stayed at the sanible resort so never left the grounds excpet for the game.. let me know thanks

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 8:44 PM by mazaratirick Highlight this comment 951

luke,

'92 was the Dave Winfield 2RBI Double.

yes, '93 was the 3-run Walkoff HR for Carter

Posted on January 4, 2011 at 11:20 PM by tk Highlight this comment 952

Anyone have some construction improvement updates? I'm surprised no one's posted any pictures or said anything about it yet. I haven't been able to make it downtown and the Twins haven't said anything or posted pictures on their website yet.

Posted on January 5, 2011 at 03:21 AM by ML Highlight this comment 953

I was down there a week ago and you can't see much from the plaza...just the scaffolding. You can't really get a good look at what's going on with the second video board. Plus there is scaffolding over it so it is hard to pick out.

Just imagine it in your head! JK

Posted on January 5, 2011 at 09:12 AM by PatMeares Highlight this comment 954

Well once again the virtual waiting rooms are back. STH pre-sale on Spring Training tickets as mentioned above opened at 10 a.m. Any tricks of the trade or tips are appreciated. I haven't had to do this before.

Posted on January 5, 2011 at 10:08 AM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 955

First window opened about 10:15, the second around 10:20, so I guess it's doable...tickets are going fast, though.

Posted on January 5, 2011 at 10:22 AM by JCTwins Highlight this comment 956

Rick, did you just forget about finishing this article? I know it's a lot of work, but I actually was looking forward to reading the rest of it.

Posted on March 1, 2011 at 10:59 AM by pwilbome@gmail.com Highlight this comment 957

wtf?

Posted on August 4, 2011 at 6:19 PM by BULLDOG Highlight this comment 958


This page was last modified on October 25, 2010.



"You talk about the magic, the aura, but what really makes a stadium is the fans. Concrete doesn't talk back to you. Chairs don't talk back to you. It's the people who are there, day in, day out, that makes the place magic."

– Bernie Williams

Explore the Site

Here are 50 images chosen randomly from the 3042 found on this site. Click the image to be taken to the original post. A new list is created every 10 minutes.





This area will supposedly show the Twins chronology. Will it stretch back to 1901?



Looking across the top of the B parking ramp. Notice that signage will block any attempts at seeing the game from up there. Also take note of the glassed in area which is part club and part office space for the Ballpark Authority.



Flagpole historian Ben McEvers at far right (click for the full photo set, graciously loaned to this site by Pat Backen)



(Click to enlarge greatly)






Just up the foul line, it looks like the base of the wall in foul territory on the right side.



This is the upper deck in Anaheim



Gate 6 Oliva, with the 573 Club looming large over it (I wonder how Tony feels about that)



Delmon Young getting warmed up



Larry DiVito, mowing



This is as close as I could get to a pedestrian-eye view of Seventh Street (looking west away from downtown). It's inviting, not imposing, and remarkably dignified.



A little ground's crew action in the first inning the other night.






Here we are waiting for the first train to arrive at the station (Nov 14).



If you are into shade, there are lots of opportunities. This is from the last row in section 108 -- scoreboard not blocked in the least.



Wrigley Field. Paradise? Not from these seats.



This area will supposedly show the Twins chronology. Will it stretch back to 1901?



Some details are visible here, like the back of an escalator.



Home Run Porch Terrace (bottom) and View (top) as seen from the top of the B ramp



This will be a great neighborhood. Note that the covering is being built for the emergency access. Also, note the streamers above, which appear to be monitoring air flow.












The scoreboard terminates the view on Fifth Street as seen from Hennepin



Those two empty seats in the front row are where we started the game.



TCF Bank Stadium. Not for baseball, but still pretty cool to watch being built.



Wow! Looking good.



Items promoting the Twins 2014 All-Star Game bid. I got to bring one of these buckets home, and Noah got his first-ever taste of Cracker Jacks.






A sampling of seats at Fenway Park



A few details worth noticing (Kauffmann Stadium, New Comiskey, Comerica Park, Source: LP)



Now, THIS is just some guy who appears to be hanging out on the LRT tracks talking to himself.






Banners on the parking ramp are a great touch. They help manage scale and turn a lemon into lemonade. On my way there today I passed the WCCO building and remembered how the Twins schedule used to be painted in giant form on the side of that building (which is no longer visible). Wouldn't that be a great thing to resurrect on the side of that ramp? A giant Twins schedule. I always thought that was cool.



Gate 3 "Killebrew"



Not my actual kids!












The glare problem.



Freight trains run in very close proximity (Jerry Bell was standing at my left elbow when I took this picture)






Champion's Club details (click to enlarge)









At Comerica Park, some aisles have railings and some do not.









Bird's-eye view of the trees


Glossary

BPM - Ballpark Magic

BRT - Bus Rapid Transit

DSP - Dave St. Peter

FSE - Full Season Equivalent

FYS - Fake Yankee Stadium (see also: NYS)

HERC - Hennepin Energy Resource Company (aka the Garbage Burner)

HPB - Home Plate Box

HRP - Home Run Porch

LC - Legends Club

LRT - Light Rail Transit

MBA - Minnesota Ballpark Authority (will own Target Field)

MOA - Mall of America

MSFC - Minnesota Sports Facilities Commission (owns the Metrodome)

NYS - New Yankee Stadium

SRO - Standing Room Only

STH - Season Ticket Holder

TCFBS - TCF Bank Stadium

TF - Target Field

Selected Bibliography - Analysis
 


(1993)
 


First Edition (1992)
 


Second Edition (2006)
 


(2008)
 

Selected Bibliography - Surveys
 


(1975)
 


Second Edition (1987)
 


Not a "Third Edition" exactly,
but it replaced the above title
(2000)
 


(2000, large coffee table)
 


Original edition (2000, round)
 


Revised edition (2006, round)
 


(2001, medium coffee table)
 


(2002, small coffee table)
 


(2003, medium coffee table)
 


(2004, very large coffee table)
 


(2006, very large coffee table)
 


Combines the previous two titles
(2007, medium coffee table)
 

Selected Bibliography - Nostalgia
 


(1992)
 


Book and six ballpark miniatures
(2004)
 

Complete Bibliography

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